Episode 12 - Introvert Vs Extrovert: The Celebrity Edition
Welcome to Episode 12 of Nicky and Moose the Podcast! Today’s episode is a can’t miss as Nicky and Moose go head to head in a sense, battling introverts vs. extroverts.
Nicky and Moose each choose 2 of their favorite celebrities they’ve covered in the past and talk about lessons learned.
Check out today’s episode to find out who they choose and the lessons we can learn from these legendary influencers to implement into our own brands and businesses.
What you will discover:
- The difference between feedback and approval
- How to step into being fully you
- The benefits of knowing strengths and weaknesses
- How to succeed and be the best at what you do
- The benefits of looking beyond the money
- Why some are struggling in a virtual world
- You don’t have to move with the money (or what’s viral) first
- What people are buying into
- There are no rules
- Why collaborate with someone
- The importance of creating frameworks and having principles
- The significance of uniquely following a blueprint
- Your tribe will find a way to pay you
Interview clips:
Kobe Bryant | Ep 11 | ALL THE SMOKE Full Podcast
J. Cole Uncensored: Why He's Not Following "Their" Rules | Sway's Universe
Kanye West Interview (2002)
Hotboxin' with Mike Tyson
The Studio Interview with Nipsey Hussle | Breaks Down 'Victory Lap' and Overcoming His Obstacle
Try Ecamm free for 14 Days nickyandmoose.com/ecamm
Nicky Saunders:
What's poppin'? What's poppin'? What's poppin'? Welcome Nicky and Moose! I'm Nicky! That's Moose! What up Moose?
Mostafa Ghonim:
What up y'all?
Nicky Saunders:
And today we're gonna do something different. It's gonna be kind of an introvert versus extrovert kind of vibe. Clearly I'm the extrovert. Clearly. Clearly he's the intro... is it clearly? I don't know if it's clear. But I think you already know the vibes. If you are new, you'll figure it out. Moose, how you feelin' about this episode?
Mostafa Ghonim:
I like this. I like this. I think this gives us an opportunity to be more of ourselves, introduce the podcast world to who are the people behind Nicky and Moose after all, so I think this is a nice little, a nice little remix for the holidays.
Nicky Saunders:
And it's not really us against each other. We're going to put celebrities into this. So this should be fun. But let's get into the intro.
Jaymie Jordan:
Two kids from Queens, cut from a different cloth. Now joining forces helping you to elevate your personal brand. Yeah, I'm talking about Nicky and Moose! Bringing you a never before seen perspective into the mindset, the mentality, the behaviors, the driving force, but more importantly, the stories behind the people and brands that you know and love the most.
Nicky Saunders:
So of course, you know, we always got to start it off with the review of the week. And this one is done by JayJay313. Nothing but the greatness... nothing but greatness in every episod . I always mess this up. I d n't even know why. But nothing but greatness in every episode e ery episode ha
Mostafa Ghonim:
Wait! Do the voice. Do the voice though. Give 'em, give 'em... I like the voice.
Nicky Saunders:
Oh I'm sorry. Ok ok my bad. Every episode has nothing... has been nothing but greatness. When Nicky drops anything, it's bound to be worth listening to or getting. Thank you both this podcast. Did he mean for this podcast? I don't know #GODSPEED -HENDO. You know, good vibes. Man that was a struggle. That was a struggle. And real quick, a lot of people, shout out to our audio listeners, wherever you're hearing this from and shout out to the YouTube viewers but a lot of the YouTube viewers were like, "Nicky, Moose, how did you get this setup?" We've been using Ecamm right? Shout out to Ecamm. So, anybody who is interested in that, there's a 14 day like free trial if you just go to nickyandmoose.com/ecamm. It'll be in the show notes. But a lot of people have been asking so I just wanted to address that real quick. But let's get into this episode. So, Moose...
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yes ma'am?
Nicky Saunders:
We're going to be doing introvert versus extrovert, right? But celebrity style. Alright, so I get two, you get two right? You like this? Okay, okay. So if you had two of
Mostafa Ghonim:
Ok, I like this. I like this. all the people, and let's, let's be a little bit more specific. We're going to go based off people we've gone over this year, whether it's from the Facebook show, or the podcast, right? Both of us has picked from the Facebook show. Just to make it a little bit new for our podcast listeners because we have a lot of new podcast listeners. So Moose, who is your two...your two celebrities? Yeah, I'm gonna start man with, to honor the late great Kobe Bryant. Start with Kobe.
Nicky Saunders:
Okay
Mostafa Ghonim:
And, and next, I'm gonna do J Cole.
Nicky Saunders:
Okay, okay. Um, and as far as team extrovert, right, I'm going to pick Kanye West and, of course, the person who just had a fight, Mike Tyson. So, do we flip a coin? What do we do? What do what do you wanna do? How do you wanna do this?
Mostafa Ghonim:
You know if I had a coin handy...yeah
Nicky Saunders:
I don't have a coin. Um, you know what? I'm gonna say introverts first, just because y'all always are like behind the scenes and stuff. So it's only right.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Fair enough. Fair enough.
Nicky Saunders:
It's only right, fair enough.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Selective. Yeah, I get it.
Nicky Saunders:
You see what I'm saying? I'm trying to do this. So who do you want to go first? Do you want to do J Cole or do you want to do Kobe?
Mostafa Ghonim:
Let's do Kobe first. Yeah, let's do Kobe first.
Nicky Saunders:
Kobe first!
Mostafa Ghonim:
Introduce the people to the Kobe.
Nicky Saunders:
Okay, so we're gonna do Kobe first. This is...where was this an interview from?
Mostafa Ghonim:
This is from...wow, I just said his name to you earlier.
Nicky Saunders:
Matt Barnes
Mostafa Ghonim:
Matt Barnes and Stephen Jackson podcast. Yeah, that's it.
Nicky Saunders:
Okay. Alright.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I don't know the name of it though.
Nicky Saunders:
We'll get the...we'll get the name in the show notes. Don't kill us. Don't kill us.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Right.
Interviewer:
You got a lot of young players that's reaching out to you now.
Kobe Byrant:
Yeah.
Interviewer:
You know, your advice to them? Like, like what you tell them? Like, how did that feel?
Kobe Byrant:
Depends what they asked me. Like, a lot of them will come and ask about their game, and things that they should do and things like that. And I say, Listen, you gotta...you know the answer to that. I don't know. But you know, what makes you uncomfortable when you play. I mean, I think that's the biggest thing for kids nowadays is that they want to rely on coaches too much and workout guy, you know, which is fineto have them help you work out. But you have to tell them what you need. Right? You have to be able to say, Okay, I feel uncomfortable with this. And if you don't know, then you're not as prepared as you should be. Right? You need to know what your strengths and weaknesses are first, and then, you know, I can tell you some of the things some of the rhythmic things, or some of the exercises or how much repetition you need to be doing on certain things. But you got to know your game.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Love that! Love that! Yeah, yeah.
Nicky Saunders:
This could be broken down in so many different ways.
Mostafa Ghonim:
So many ways.
Nicky Saunders:
So many different ways. Um, you go for your first. You go for it first.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, yeah. S man, this, this is...the reas n why I picked this specific cli , y'all right, especiall for my introvert squad, is be ause we are definitely those pe ple who need constant confirma ion. We need constant feedback, onstant approval of Yes, this i right. Keep going. And we've eard so many people talk about t on on the show, either ones that we have played their c ips, or people that we've brough on and interviewed and said, H y, tell us about your secrets. How did you build your brand? How did you build your busin ss, and they all talk ab ut this constant factor of rusting their intuitio , being authentically them. At some point, as an introvert, ou have to embrace what you brin to the marketplace. Becau e we've talked about the valu factor before and said that wha ever is most valuable, is typica ly rare in its existence, mean ng that there's not much of t. I've been taking L's like razy on the sneaker app, and we ve been laughing about it. L git the last three or four mon hs like Yo, every single week, L, L. No. Sorry. Sorry I mean it's like yo what...yo what Ill minati is behind this? For re l, seriously, I need to know, r ght? You told me to get mul iple screens, and I got mul iple screens. And guess what?
Nicky Saunders:
Yo.
Mostafa Ghonim:
So where I would normally get just got multiple L's. one...unbelievable yo. Unbelievable. But guess what? It's because Jordan has put the value on his product that it's rare. And because it's rare in its existence, its price is high. Demand is high. And it sells out every single week, religiously nonstop. So what I'm saying is we're constantly seeking approval, there is a difference between feedback and approval, right? Like, there's a difference between Hey, I need an adjustment versus Hey, tell me if I'm doing this, right. If we're constantly seeking that, you water down your genius. So I can go on this for days, Nicky, but I'm just gonna kind of introduce it at least right here. I'm really curious to know, even a little bit from your perspective as well, not so
Nicky Saunders:
So, I mean, it goes back to that last part that much as an introvert because clearly you're an extrovert, but he said with understanding your strengths and weaknesses, right? just that concept of there was a point where clearly and we talked about it, where you started stepping into your zone So what, like me and you've been really big on is really reading like Yo, I'm just about to be straight up and down Nicky. Like into the flight assessment, flightassessment.com small plug, just fully Nicky. Right? Talk to us a little bit about that. right, but reading into the assessment and really figuring Because I think that piece is important for everyone listening right now. Because again, as you listen to Kobe, the part that I out our highs and lows, like, what is our talents and what are like the most is he's saying, yo, you're going to a coach and our non talents, right? And so the only real time that I truly you should know what's wrong, right? Like you you at some point should know, hey, here's the problem. Here's what I need fixing with. But, but but not that I want to walk by your side stepped into just being Nicky was when I identified both. and you tell me what to do when I run out and do it. Talk to us about that a little bit. Like, I didn't have to play guessing games, I didn't necessarily have to trial and error anymore. I knew this is what I'm dope at. And this is what I lack at, you know, this is where I have to either figure out something that can be a system to automate this thing, or I should just find somebody else to do it. Right. But also, what's interesting about what he said, and I'm thinking from a branding standpoint, right, is you have to know, before even approaching anybody, the strengths and weaknesses, and that's also like, with not only with yourself, but like, with your brand, what are the gaps that it can feel? What can it really do for the audience? What can you know, the value it adds, but as well as understanding your audience as well, because you could look at it from a standpoint of Kobe is now the coach, and all these people are coming to him, like, hey, just help me. I don't know what, but help me. And as a coach, you c n't necessarily be effective, b cause you don't have the a swers for everything. Right? Y u have specific answers s ecific solution. So I think, a so from a standpoint of, like a brand and business side of t ings like you are what Kobe w s as the coach. And so you h ve specific solutions for your a dience, aka the players, r ght? You have to help them i entify what they're looking f r. You have to say, this is w at I do. So they could a proach you like, I need this. C ach, I need this brand. Right? Y u know, yeah. And that's why i 's important for us, as, you k ow, brands to be like, oh, o ay, I have these specific s lutions. Because I think t at's why also, why he said, y u know, what you need, right? Y u know that because he also k ows, like, I can't solve e erything. Right? So I need you t identify to see if this is a p rfect fit. Because if you come t me with just help me in bas etball, and though I am the bes of the best, there's still I c n't help you in generic, gen ric things. Like maybe I don t know how to go back to the ver beginning. Maybe I can't tea h you how to have handles. May e I can't teach you the bas c shooting joints. But I kno certain defense situations, I k ow certain advanced tec niques. And so if you don't kno what you what you want, or wha you want to improve, I'm not that person for you. Right, rig t. And I look at that from for even myself, like, I'm not for everybody. I'm for specific, lik personal brands, right? And so ig companies and everything lik that, Yo, I have a social med a problem. I have a content pro lem. What exactly? I can't nec ssarily help you. Right. But if personal brain goes yo I hav content problems, I can't com up with ideas. All right, we ould talk about that. You kno , so that's one of the thi gs and and I know, like he was meaning from a coach in a pla er's standpoint, but we have to ook at it from just all asp cts of because Kobe's even Mam a Mentality can be flipped int just life lessons. And so I look at that clip as like, shoo if you were a coach, like e en a life coach or consultant, t at could be a lesson from t e strengths and weaknesses th ng. You know. From a branding st ndpoint, from a business stan point that could be like, beca se it's so important to eally identify and hone in on th se strengths and weaknesses. A d I know you don't like saying w aknesses, but it's just the comm n theme that everybody say .
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, no, I know it's the word that is you know, used to describe weaknesses, that's fine. I'm good with that. I'm, I'm against it, because I feel that there's a way to to, to diminish weaknesses or to lower weaknesses or to defeat them in a sense, but now I'm with you. I'm with you. I like how you spun that though. To be honest with you. Shout out to you by the way, my soundboard is a little too far. I want to press a button and give you like a drop or something. But now I'm just like, yo, that's crazy. You just spun the spun the whole basketball analogy into a brand new lesson, but it's real. It's real. It's very real. And it applies, right? It applies because I think we've we've definitely gotten to a place where we've complicated and and most people when you look at them, again, this is regardless now across this either extrovert or introvert, they get to a point where they make it look so easy, just seamless, like they were in a groove consistent. They're doing it regularly. Yeah, because they have not complicated the process. They're not constantly second guessing themselves. They're not stopping, writing, deleting, rewriting, they, you know, like, again, these are all introverted problems, and I know them because I've lived them. And I've had to make my own personal adjustments to overcome that and just kind of take what Kobe mentioned in that clip and say, all right, what are the adjustments? Like there are certain seasons in your life where you're just strictly in student mode. So you may go to a coach for the purpose of Hey, teach me what you got. Here's my goal. I can't tell you specifically what I want. But from a big picture standpoint, here's what I'd like to achieve. Teach me, teach me what you got. But at some point, you got to cut that off and reproduce what you learned or either like adding your spin to it and putting that out back to the marketplace so yeah, no fire clip I wanted to lead off that again, and shout out to Kobe man.
Nicky Saunders:
Shout out to Kobe um, next one is J Cole.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Are you gonna go back to back?
Nicky Saunders:
You want to go flip...? Okay
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah let's do flip mode on 'em.
Nicky Saunders:
Ok I wanted you to stack it but all right we out here.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I thought like the Verzuz mode. We're gonna...well it's not a battle but it's a...you know what I'm saying?
Nicky Saunders:
Okay we're not doing Verzuz because it's not gonna be Kobe versus Kanye cuz that's just crazy. Well, no, I'll do...I'll do a athlete versus athlete so I'll do...
Mostafa Ghonim:
Oh you got Tyson. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah I got Tyson. I got in these streets okay? So here is Mike Tyson.
Mike Tyson:
That's all I focus on. That's why I didn't want any days when I didn't want to fight. All I did was watch fights all day. ...Guys from the 1890s to now. I used to watch them all day. That's all I did. Cuz that's all I wanted to be. That's all I knew. I knew all the etiquette about fighting. Anything you asked me about fighting I could tell you. How did it begin? How did it start? I knew everything about fighting.
Interviewer:
Cus believed that a boxer's thoughts should only be about fights. Only an obsession could lead to success.
Nicky Saunders:
So I'll start this one off. I think it's self explanatory. As far as maybe why I picked this clip. Just cuz you have to and as cliche as it sounds, you have to be obsessed with your craft. Like, if you're really trying to be the best at what you do. You can't do this sparingly. You can't do this on a Monday, Tuesday and Friday. You know, you have to wake up wanting to do this. Wake up at 2:48 in the morning and be like, yo, there's a problem. Okay, so did you format it in this kind of way? Like you should know without taking the cold out your eye. How to solve something or be the best at it in your craft because that's how all the greats were. They were obsessed with. Like Kobe was obsessed with basketball. Michael Jordan was obsessed with basketball. Mike Tyson was obsessed with boxing any of the greats that you have they were obsessed with their craft, right? And, you know, I'm going to spin it to what I do, right? When we look at from a social media standpoint, and all the people who are like, I can't grow, I'm not growing. Like, are you obsessed with your own brand? Like, are you on it every single day? Are you sparingly with it? Like, I'm not asking you to be on a 24/7, but you should care for it every single day, you should be involved with it every single day as part of what you do. It's part of your brand. Right? What are you learning more in your industry? How have you studied your competitors? And the great thing about how we do this podcast and just learning from that, it's just different lessons that we can take from how he became number one is how we can become number one. If he like woke up, ate, dreamed, talked about boxing, do we have the same energy for our craft and our brand and business? If we don't, then we're not going to get to certain statuses like a Mike Tyson, like a Kobe like a Kanye and everybody else. Say what you want about Kanye. I'll get into that. But I think when we look back at Mike, and we look how, you know, the fear that people had of him, the you know, the accomplishments that he had, all the money that he had everything like that. It was because all he knew was boxing. So, even later down the line, when it came to real life, like he didn't even know how to deal with real life because all he knew was boxing. Right. So um, what you know, this podcast never condones any of the bad stuff or anything like that, but I want to do acknowledge it a little bit. But it's it's still the part that he was glorified for. And he just did a fight a few weeks ago against Roy Jones, Jr. Was it weeks ago? I feel like it was like last week, but few weeks ago, depending on when you hear this podcast right? And still looked amazing. Still, and I think that...
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yo his training videos leading up to that were ridiculous.
Nicky Saunders:
Crazy. Crazy. But you think about it. Because he was so obsessed with it before. It's like riding a bike. Like you can't like it...let me get this rust off real quick. But I'm back. I'm I'm back like I never left. Right because there was some there was some shots that I thought Roy Jones was gonna go. I thought he was gonna go it was gonna be bad. He he held on a little bit too much.
Mostafa Ghonim:
And a lot of people thought he won that. Yeah, a lot of people thought he won that.
Nicky Saunders:
Who?!
Mostafa Ghonim:
Tyson that is. Tyson won that. It wasn't a tie, but I think they just did it like as a as a respect thing like, yo, Let's end it in a tie was you know, entertaining...
Nicky Saunders:
Of course, of course. But um, at the same time, I'm like, we all know who won. You. We all know you were holding on a little bit for dear life. You were... you got hit and you're like, No, no, no, no, no, but like...And I want to get your standpoint of of the clip. But it's, because he worked so hard in the beginning years. And what we know of Mike Tyson, when he got back in the ring, it was like we expected him to win. Like we expected him to look that good. Even at what 50? What is he? 50?
Mostafa Ghonim:
Up there. He's up there.
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah, like, he still looks like he could compete if he wanted to. Np questions about that. The speed like and I think it was just slow down because it was not a real fight. So that's what I'll say.
Mostafa Ghonim:
After all the craziness too.
Nicky Saunders:
Oh, facts, facts. What do you gotta say about the clip?
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, I mean, his dedication and you know, like, it's not something that is forced onto you because I think that that there's a reason why we talk about the concept of strengths and superpowers and finding your unique lane. When it's something that you want, you add passion to obsession, like you, you're passionate about what you're studying. So the energy almost recycles itself like you're really into it. It never stops. When it's not what you want. And again, I'm this is one of my main quotes for 2021, of course, is from our book that we're reading, Ray Dalio, Principles book that he said, money is not a byproduct of excellence. Excuse me, "money is a byproduct of excellence, not a goal." "Money is a byproduct of excellence, not a goal." So when you pursue something...I'm telling you. Major, right? Major, yep.
Nicky Saunders:
That was good. That was good. You see the late delay. I was like, wait...mmmm!
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that is one of the main pillars that I just want to remind myself and others of for the new year, like, yo, if at some point, you have to go beyond just paying your bills. At some point, you have to go just beyond making sure you got yourself a new client, a new gig, a new customer, a new whatever, to keep you rolling, and start really asking yourself yo what's the bigger picture here? Like, what what are we really doing? What is this after all, right? And I think once we shift our focus, from money to excellence at that thing that we so rightfully choose, the game changes, the game changes. So there was even a training that we were on last week and it was with some of the top advisors from JP Morgan and Chase. So the top 400 people in the entire country that have over 4000, branches, the top 400 were on the call. And the answers, the knowledge, the chemistry, the camaraderie amongst their team. And their desire to learn more, is so pure, like, it's so easy to recognize, because there's a passion for the industry, there's a passion for what they do. Alright, so I think, definitely, from a business standpoint, even a brand new standpoint, if you want to go that far to speak about it, that when you begin to really combine your passion with your obsession. And I know that you're like, oh, but that could be the same thing. No, it's different. you're passionate about something, right? You you, you're naturally interested in it, and then use an obsession to be good at it or excel at it. That combination is a deadly, it's a deadly thing. So yeah, Mike Tyson is great man again, his life unfortunately, you know, went through some challenges after his trainer passed, but he's turned it around on the lesson doing some incredible things. So it's, it's awesome to see that come around for him.
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah, shout out to our early early day one people who saw the Facebook Live Show with the Mike Tyson. That was... I was gonna... we were talking about it earlier. That was definitely like, we thought it was gonna be one of the best shows. So many highlights. And there was Mike has some troubling times. But what he's accomplished is Yeah, what he's accomplished and what we can all learn from when he was at his height is still irreplaceable, so shout out to Mike Tyson. All right, it's your turn. It's your turn.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Cole world!
Nicky Saunders:
You got you ready for Cole?
Mostafa Ghonim:
You remember you... hold on. You remember the infamous battle that we had on this... on the J Cole episode? We went like two and a half hours on that episode. This was early, early Nicky and Moose!
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah, it's, uh, if anybody's interested on it, it's on YouTube. It's like our very first upload on YouTube. He was very passionate about it. And even some people. Even some people afterwards was like Moose, yeah, no. He's how's everybody on Nicky's side? This is crazy.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I couldn't believe it. I still can't believe it. But yeah, I'm with it.
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah. So we're not gonna get into debate because Moose likes me today. So, um, go check out the very first upload of the YouTube channel and it is the debate or just go to the Nicky and Moose debate playlist that we have, which we need to be we needed the bait, something else. So all the listeners and viewers if you want us to debate about something, tweet us or hit us up in a DM's or something because I can't debate with him on anything lately. It's the weirdest thing. But let's get into J Cole.
J Cole:
We don't have to have the features. We don't have to drop the single. You don't have to have the radio record before they put your album out. You don't have to follow them moves. You can put out what you love and still sell records if you if you connected with people. It ain't gonna be overnight. You could do art first and then build a business around it. That's what I figured out. That's what I've been doing. Definitely.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Cole world! Cole world! Cold world! Yeah, no and
Nicky Saunders:
I'ma let you go. I know I can go in on this one. and you know what this is this is for some of the people who are super analytical, or like extremely strategic, like you're so systematic and you really have to think through all the pieces. I think you... I see the keywords. I see the keywords. I see what you did there. I see what you did there.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I was trying to play, right. But it's it's definitely for those folks who identify as such, and never give themselves permission. Never gives themselves permission to do things out of order. Because in your mind, it has to be perfect first, right? Or it's got to be a certain way. And I think you get to see an awesome example of one of the best artists of our generation. And yes, I just did say that.
Nicky Saunders:
That's big. That's big. That's big.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I'm gonna hang my hat on that. I'm gonna hang my hat on that. I'm a big J Cole fan. I like J Cole's work a lot. I think there's a lot of...
Nicky Saunders:
I'ma let that go. I'ma let that go.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, but anyway, but but my point is, regardless of how you feel about him, you can't argue that the man is successful. Right? In his specific lane in his industry, you can't argue that he's successful. And when you listen to the full length of that interview, he's really talking about how when he started with Jay, he was so caught up in the like living up to the expectations and the business and this, this, this that, but that's not who he was. So sometimes, you really just got to give yourself permission to do things out of order sometimes. So that you can let some sort of momentum begin to build up. And once that happens, right, what you're going for begins to you get a nice little rhythm going, it's like you start instead of pushing up hill all the time is like you turn a corner and start coming downhill now. It's a lot easier, right? Like, you find your rhythm, you find your momentum, you find your flow. So I like that he says that because I think for a lot of people, you see it one way, or here's another thing that we often see. And I'm trying to merge worlds, right, like going into some of the things that I hear or problems that I see with teams and businesses or organizations and bringing it into this context, one of the biggest challenges that people are having right now, and why they're struggling in their businesses to keep open or to keep people engaged through working in virtual spaces is that they have not adapted or changed. They want to stick to how they did things traditionally. And in today's world, nothing is traditional about COVID. Like nothing, nothing that we used to do is the same today, right? Like literally if you think about your entire year, everything how we do everything has changed. So when another part of that what creates the challenges for those who are just stuck in the past how it was done, or how they see others doing it. So you're trying to follow those blueprints, that's when it doesn't line up Nicks.
Nicky Saunders:
I agree. I agree. I think this, you know, this, this clip hits more from my creative side, because it shows that you don't necessarily have to move with money first. You don't necessarily have to move on the business side first, it all comes together. When you honestly love what you do. Like you're honestly doing it, because you want to I think you put more energy towards the things you have passion, the love for the things that you create the things that you do, you have more love for it than the things that you feel like you have to produce, the things that they tell you to do the things that they force you to do, though the check may be good, the opportunities could be blessed. It's still not going to be the same compared to what you want to put out. Right. And when we look at it from kind of like an artist standpoint of any sort, right? We think of sometimes the people first so if we're talking about music, was going to be the hit was going to get people you know, rocking in the cars and the clubs and everything like that. What is going to have radio play when that was a situation and it was not enough. Maybe you're probably third or fourth album, to you're like, I created this for me, like I've created such a, a, a solid fan base that now I can start creating stuff for me and I know they're gonna rock with me like they get to see my true side. And if we look at how Jay Cole did his first album, his first album was to be on the charts was to impress Jay and be like, Yo, I got to Radiohit, you know, we've workout. And we look at that. And even from a standpoint of how we are online, like we always look for that viral hit. We always look for what can make people like really rock with this kind of content. And it really is something different. When you create what you want to create, and that hits. And that works. And that's what people are buying into. And people are buying, not only into what you create, but everything around that. So when he when he said that it brought confirmation that you don't necessarily have to go with what the blueprint was before. You can now create your own blueprint based off your passion and your love and your energy towards what you want to create. And create doesn't necessarily mean from an artistic standpoint, only it can mean from business standpoint, like what business do you want to create, and if you have passion for if you have energy for it, you know, it doesn't necessarily have to go the same route as everybody else did.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Absolutely. Absolutely. If you think about it, too, like in today's world, there are no rules. There are no rules, people are doing things backwards, upside down, reverse order, remix all the time. Because there there there are other elements that are becoming more important. Like the element of connection. The element of honesty, just being 100%, like very straightforward and direct. That's another element that now is really coming before and breaking records, then someone who has traditionally done things in the perfect order how it needs to go. And I'll get me wrong. There are there are elements, like there are universal laws that you need to follow, right? Like, you cannot say, Well, I'm about to do things backwards. I'm gonna put gas in my car, after the engine blows up. It's like, okay, buddy, my friend. That's a universal law, right? Like you have to the gas comes first. Right? Like, there's just I'm not saying go crazy with it. But there are some things that today honestly, it doesn't matter, like what order you follow or how you go about it. So yeah.
Nicky Saunders:
These are facts. These are all facts. Shout out to J Cole. Um, and now see this is...praise God, we have like a bonus one because I don't want to end with this one.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Right.
Nicky Saunders:
I don't want to listen. I have made it very known that regardless of what people say, I think I've learned the most about this individual because of his complete freedom of speech. Cuz his complete creativity and his ways of the world. And how it makes people feel like it's okay to live in a bubble. Because when you think about it, it isolates you from other people's influence. And so he created his own thought process, and to sit there and say that he's wrong. But where are you getting your information, your influence from? Like, he got me thinking all random stuff. And if you don't know who I'm talking about, we're talking about Kanye. So, let's, let's get into this clip.
Kanye West:
Anybody ever said in life would be a disadvantage to me, I'm gonna make it my advantage. When I was playing basketball, everybody said I was too short, I'm killing them with the scoops. You know, I'm saying? Everybody said you can't rap because you were a producer. Okay. Oh, I hear that beat. Oh, yeah, I know I produced it. I just rapped on it before you got a chance to hear it. You know what I'm saying? Like I'm gonna use everything that everybody says that I can't do or and I'm gonna flip it to the positive.
Nicky Saunders:
So that sounds like his whole career, by the way. Sounds like his whole career. Um, we can even just talk about the recent recent one. People said he wouldn't be a president and he ran for it. Not that clearly, he is not the President, but he definitely ran, he definitely tried. And you can only respect the person for trying because there are people who wouldn't, right? Um, definitely different views definitely looked crazy out in the streets. But what we can respect from Kanye is that he does not care what people think he's gonna do whatever he wants to do, and that such a freedom. I think a lot of us want.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Absolutely. Talk about that.
Nicky Saunders:
I think I think we, we care too much about what people say. And it stops us from really, truly being who we were really put on this earth to be. But we sit and we try to get affirmations from people who haven't lived what we want to do, and who haven't pretty much been even close to this, the success that we're trying to gain. And the best part about Kanye, whatever you may think about him, is that freedom of doing whatever he want to do. Now, you may not agree. But that's not his concern. You may not like him, but that's not his concern. He's going to own his own record label, he's going to rap he's going to be a CEO, he's going to win Grammys, he's going to be on the billboards, he's going to run for presidency, and no one stopped him. He's going to have Sunday Service, and and talk about his faith. And no one's going to stop him because he doesn't allow anybody to stop him. And we allow people to stop us because of their own opinions about us, or what we are doing because they think it's wrong. But who are they to say it's wrong? I love how he's like, yo, you suck at this. Well, you know what, I'm gonna do it anyways, that almost gave him extra fuel to just prove people wrong. But there are too many people who have this fear of what people will say, right? I know. I had this conversation on my IG live. And this has been a, I call it a trending topic, because I don't accept it from anybody, this whole imposter syndrome. Right? And it took me a minute to like, What in the world is that? And that's literally like, a personal fear, right? of being a fraud. Like, of what people will think of them, and they doubt their skills and their talents and everything like that. Kanye did not suffer from that at all. At all.
Mostafa Ghonim:
My man was good in that department.
Nicky Saunders:
Right? Right. But what is...and the crazy thing is, I went off on this topic, but I'm big on we make up words, and we put power to it. And now people are like, Oh my God, that's me, too. Oh, my God, that's me too. But we're not looking at other individuals that are honestly doing something and being like, that could be me. And that's me too.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah.
Nicky Saunders:
Did that hit? I don't know.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Crazy? Oh, definitely hit. Definitely hit. Yeah. Because no, because I'm just thinking like, you know, think about how many times people approach relationships. And again, this is I'm not just talking about personally, I'm talking about professional relationships. And they, and one of the common mistakes people make is, oh, we have a lot of things in common from our past. We should link up. And it's like, no you don't get with someone because of the things that you share in common over your past, you get it, you get what people because of what you guys share in the future. Yes. So that that is a big discrepancy, or just off the bat people something that people don't see and know that they're doing because they're getting with people based off of their past instead of where they're going. And the other thing is, they never flip the script and give themselves an opportunity to see a different story. I'm not gonna name this person, we're working with someone right now, who is definitely the top of his class. Absolute top of his class. All right, very high level. And this is a huge year for him a huge opportunity, like to really set just call it his own personal legacy. What he's dealing with, and I'm going to speak very vaguely, just again, because I want to keep the confidentiality of the situation, but what he's dealing with,
Nicky Saunders:
That's what good coaches do people. That's what good coaches do. I just want to put that out there.
Mostafa Ghonim:
It's something that, let's say less than 10 people have dealt with in their lives. Less than 10. Okay. Now, those 10 unfortunately, did not recover from it. But the entire time he's been looking at and say, yo, believe it or not, this is mad rare. Only 10 people have gotten this ever, and they've never made it back. And I'm like, Yo this entire time, you've been telling yourself the same story everybody else said, what about the reverse order? What about the fact that you guys have so you have so many things in your in your favor, that are different than those other 10? You're younger, right? Like you're in a, you're in a sweeter position, you're making better investments, there's better health care, there are better opportunities, right? Like, we never give ourselves the opportunity to tell ourselves the other side of the story. And I'm just saying like, to your point with that, and I'm sorry, Kanye, we'll come back to you in just a moment. But to your point with that, it's like no, give yourself an opportunity to tell yourself a different side of the story, man, I just literally do the polar opposite of flipped descriptive, but you would normally think and because imposter syndrome is deep man like that. That's a real, it's a real thing. It's a real thing.
Nicky Saunders:
I hear you on that. I do. Um, I just think people use it as an excuse now. Like that we put a label on it. Now they given it power. Where, before it was maybe just fear, like, doubt of oneself, they now labeled it into imposter syndrome, which gave it an extra spice to it. And now they're like, running with it. No, no, this is called... and I said this on my, my Instagram. And this is like, no offense at all. But this is the same way as we hear a certain kind of sickness and all the sudden we feel symptoms of it. And we're like, Yo, I have that too. Oh, my God, I have that. That's that. Yo, is flu season. You were not feeling sick. What are you talking about? You weren't...you don't have a fever? I think I have it just feel my forehead. No, you don't have it. And so when you continue to hear something over and over again. And that's the thing, like over and over again, we've heard imposter syndrome. And then in with with people's lanes, they're like, Oh, my God, I think I suffered through imposter syndrome. You did? That's what you call it. Oh, I did that, too. This makes sense why did this that and the third, and they hold on to it. And they run with it. Like that's not...that doesn't give you an excuse.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah...I don't want to discount it because I feel like where you're coming from. But I know it's a real concept. Where I do agree with you, though, is that people look for connection in some of the the more broken areas sometimes like it's a broken concept. I don't know why Yes, I can connect and relate to your point. It's not something that should be given power to but it's, it's the desire to want to say, yo, me too. Yeah, that that creates that concept where it's like, again, if we can if we can get out of our past and into our future. I'm not I'm not thinking about it. That way. I can kind of say, yeah, it was a similar experience. But let's talk man, maybe that's something we need to do. Maybe we need to start talking more about our futures instead of our past.
Nicky Saunders:
And with that, I just, I just don't want to give power and a title of acceptance to something negative.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Is it really acceptance, though?
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah, I think it is.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Because you gave it a title that becomes acceptance as you think?
Nicky Saunders:
If you give somebody like a girlfriend title like...
Mostafa Ghonim:
Oh, no, no, no! Don't do that. Don't do that.
Nicky Saunders:
Is that...is that not a level of acceptance? Is that not a level acceptance?
Mostafa Ghonim:
That's a different concept though.
Nicky Saunders:
You get, no you give somebody a title. That is acceptance of everything that comes along with it. That's acceptance. You have this title.I use a very exaggerant
Mostafa Ghonim:
I can see that. I could see that. The girl the one. But break it down. When you give a title you accept everything that's part of that title. You almost become girlfriend thing was a little much but I see...
Nicky Saunders:
I know that's just me. That's just me okay. I didn't I didn't want to say wife that was a little bit too dramatic. Right? So right. So I said girlfriend, but the the sense of once you're given a title, you accept the roles and responsibilities and the character and the detail characters of that that title. You do.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I don't know what I don't know why it's not like I'm with you. But it's just not it's not. You know what I'm saying? It's not like...
Nicky Saunders:
Because you probably, because this is the thing. I don't want to put light to it to those people who really, like deal with that. So I'm not, I don't want to discredit people. But at the same time, I do know more people who use it and is like, me too. I have imposter syndrome. This is why I'm still not doing it. Because I really suffered through imposter syndrome. But what are you doing to get out of
Mostafa Ghonim:
That's the part I was just about to say. Yep it? that's the part that I was about to say. That that that to to identify but not diagnose or come up with a treatment plan if we're going to just make it if we're gonna call it a sickness I think that's the real problem. Okay, I'm with you on that. I'm with you on that. Yeah. Because if you sit in it without without a desire to kind of like Alright, well, how do I get over this fear of being a fraud that would it what fraud I get you Okay,
Nicky Saunders:
Facts. I'm just saying. Just saying. But we got a bonus one. This was not really a verzuz kind of thing. This is that like, but because it's not fair. It's not fair that did that way. But um, we got a bonus one. Pretty much to you know, we're at the end of the year depending on when you hear this right. And this was one of the...oh breaking news! Hold on breaking news! Hold on! Breaking news! Depending when you hear this, I'm gonna let this bomb drop, we just got 6,000 downloads of the podcast. Just got the notification shout out to everybody who listens from day one to all our brand new listeners. Thank you. Thank you just got that notification. And I wanted to congratulate y'all! Congratulate y'all! Congratulate us! This is for the people. This is for the people.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Absolutely! This is for the people. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, but this was one I think of the most requested breakdowns I saw it late today. Yeah. from the both of us and dep nding when you started l stening to us in our Facebook L ve days, well we still do th se, but the show part, we broke own the late, great Nipsey Hussle and if anybody knows me, I am big on Nip. Literally yo could go downstairs I have lik four or five Nipsey joints a
Nicky Saunders:
Fuego! Fuego! far as canvases and everythin like that. I don't know if yo
Mostafa Ghonim:
That joint is large too it's like against the saw the new one. Did you see he new one in my stories? whole wall right?
Nicky Saunders:
Yes, it covers my whole chimney kind of whatever...fireplace not the chimney.
Mostafa Ghonim:
I get you. Okay, it's Christmas, you know? It's alright. I get you.
Nicky Saunders:
...So, um, we're gonna go over one of the things that we've learned from Nip and probably in the future, we're
Mostafa Ghonim:
That's what's up. That's so dope. going to do a whole podcast episode about Nip. And my whole thing I... and Moose always kn ws at least once a year, we re gonna go over Nip from the l ssons...because he left not only an amazing legacy. Did you see the article? He left $4.1 million estate. They finally eah, um, they finally did all like the appraisals and all t at great stuff. And the estate is worth $4.1 million. That's cr zy.
Nicky Saunders:
Yeah, that's, that's the legacy. That's right there. So we're gonna bring him back for the $100 mixtape lesson.
Nipsey Hussle:
I don't ever make moves under pressure. I try not to. On Crenshaw I said this gonna be the first time I give my fan base a directness so if you want to reciprocate, for the inspiration that I've given you over the course of these five mixtapes. Here's how you do it. Proud to Pay it's $100 CD, come to the... you see I had won over enough people that we sold out the first 1000 in the first day. My whole intention was just getting people talking to it. I want everybody to you know be like why is he charging $100? What make you think it's worth $100?
Nicky Saunders:
Moose, you got it.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, I'm gonna just touch on the first part. You know, where he says I don't make moves under pressure. And, and, and I'm not trying to sound deep, per se. But what I've done is I've tried surrounding myself with a series of frameworks and like things that I can use like principles, if you will, to really guide what to do and what not to do. So when he says I don't make moves under pressure it reminds me of some I read that says, "never trust your tongue when your heart is bitter." Right? Because no, but it's true. Because it's like, yo, if if my heart is bitter, then I can say some things that I probably can't take back. And it's that same exact framework. For a business person, entrepreneur, or personal brand especially, is like not making moves under pressure can that protects you from going down the wrong path. You might you might make a move because of the current circumstance or situation that you're in probably overreact, say something that you're not supposed to say do something that probably is not in the best interest for you, your brand, your business or your family. And find yourself somewhere down the line, six months, a year, a couple years, like, you know, how did I get here? And because you're not someone who operates under pressure, so I love that he starts with that, again, because you see successful figures giving you permission to say, yo, not all successful, people have to be sharp under pressure.
Nicky Saunders:
That's true. I like that. I like that.
Mostafa Ghonim:
You know, you can Yeah, you can definitely give yourself or surround yourself with others who are and you you know how that whole thing works. But I love that he started with that I don't make moves under pressure.
Nicky Saunders:
Look, you know how I feel about Nip and, I'm not gonna go too too deep.
Mostafa Ghonim:
But you're still going to go deep.
Nicky Saunders:
I'm going to try not to. So from this part only because, yeah, I'm already looking at the time. But um, I promise you, it's not gonna be that deep. Um, the $100 mixtape changed a lot. And it's something that we can look at today. And really, still take note and take action on. Right, he took something that normally was only like $5. And he created a price point, um, based off a book that he read, which was Contagious, right? And shout out to Big Bob because I know Big Bob and he gave me a copy of Contagious recently, even though I read it, he gave it to me and that's the person who taught Nipsey about all of branding and marketing right. And so he took a mixtape made into $100 put into a small, you know, amount of mixtapes to sell, but he had a price point that he wanted to make, I think it was like 100K, right? So, he was only selling a certain amount for $100 and they sold out. People like Jay Z bought it, because they saw like, Yo he's doing things different. And we look at that and we like yo what are we doing that is kind of rattling the industry. And in that we're doing something that is so left field that people have to almost check it out. Because what he he created was word of mouth. It wasn't even necessarily about the music, even though the music was good. It was about how can I truly stand out in a very crowded area, he was independent. That was, I was gonna say at the time, but he he, you know, he died independent. So he was independent. And so there's a lot of things he had to take on himself. So when we're looking at a branding and marketing standpoint, when it comes to our product, we have to try to look at what's already been done, but how do we put our spin to it? So mixtapes are already being done. But how does one independent artists create buzz of his own, and be able to sell out, instead of having the backing of the machine, aka, the music, the record labels. So when he did that, it caused such a stir, because Who in the world will sell a mixtape for $100. But when you do something for, you know, a limited amount, you put any price tag to it, especially if you have a brand that has an amazing reputation, especially if you've had the trust of the people. He created a fan base first, he put out a whole plethora of music before, but when he brought out his mixtape, he did a Proud to Pay campaign. And people were proud to pay for it. They showed it and everything like that they have the CDs, and shout out to those who still have the CDs to this day. Right. He said, yo, as a music artists, we have to allow our fans to support us in some kind of way, because he also saw that things were going more into a streaming wave. So at some point, he would have to as many people heard me say, sell air, because that's what streaming pretty much is you're selling an idea of thought and experience, you're not selling anything physical. So he took Yo, the digital world is here. Let me still sell something physical and be and have memorabilia for my fans. And when we look at it from Now, from this standpoint of this day and age, we can still come out with our own product and services. That is unlimited amount, and put a price tag to it. If we've added enough value to our audience, if we've added enough value, and attention to our tribe members, the money isn't necessarily the issue. People will pay whatever they deem you are worth. So if you put out $1,000 product, and you've given so much value, and you have a credible work ethic and and trust with your fan base, with your audience, with your clients, with your tribe members, that 1000 isn't anything... we find. We concentrate on the things that we want, we find ways to get what we want, right? Hence why we will do anything to make sure we have a car or something for those people don't live in New York and don't need a car. But those people who need a car will find a way to get a car right? We'll find a way to have maybe the the PS5 even though we know we didn't get the money for a PS5, we'll find a way for it. We'll find a way for the newest Apple products. Phone came out we gotta buy it. Like why because the brands have done such a remarkable job that they almost make it as a need. So I started off with a need which some people with the car, right? But the type of car isn't necessarily a need is the vehicle but not the type of car. Right? Ah AirPods the headphones may be a need, not those type of headphones. But people don't necessarily care. If it's a if it's a need, they make it into a need based off what you've done for them, or the status that you make them feel or the acceptance that you made them feel right The value that you've add to them. So what Nip did in the time when he was alive, was create such a solid fan base that it didn't matter how much he sold that mixtape, people were going to buy it, he then down the line. So mailbox money for $1,000 and people bought it right? Now, what are you doing with your brand, that there is one or two things that you could put any kind of price point on and people are going to buy, if there's nothing like that you need to still do a lot of work, you still need to do some nurturing some value adds to people, right? You need to get your credibility, right. Because what you can't sit here and say about Nip is that he didn't have any kind of credibility. He was very respected in in the hip hop game, he was very respected as a leader, not only within his in LA, or California, but like worldwide. So the thing that I always get from this interview from this standpoint of the $100 mixtape is understanding that it's really about the brand that you build, and not necessarily the product that you have. Who are you as a person? Who are Right, depending who you talk to it is. And so you? As far as in the lives of your audience? How do they hold you? Because that's what's going to create the bag is not how good your music is, is not how good your products or services but who are you? Because people buy into people. People don't buy into a product, people don't buy into a service. Like it unless it's like an essential of what we've learned this year. Essential item, right? Music is not necessarily an essential item. But depending who you talk to, it is. how are you creating something that's essential in people's lives? Because Nip did. And when he passed, it was very evident. It's still felt to this day. So I say that, like what are you doing to become essential in people's lives instead of just say want? Because that $100 mixtape became essential to certain people. So yeah, that's all I got. I didn't go too deep. I'm still in time. So real quick, real quick, quick announcements. Every Tuesday, 7:30pm, Eastern 6:30pm Central...I don't know West Coast time!
Mostafa Ghonim: 4:
30
Nicky Saunders: 4:30! 4:
30pm West Coast time. We are on Facebook every Tuesday facebook.com/nickyandmoose. We are live. We are answering your questions. We're doing kind of like exclusive conversations. So always join us there and on all
platforms:
Instagram, Twitter, we're on there. Follow us. We hit a 1k on all platforms. That's a good look. That's all because of y'all. So we appreciate y'all. Moose, how did you feel about this episode?
Mostafa Ghonim:
I like them. I like the exchange. You know what I'm saying? We we had an intelligent conversation. This
Nicky Saunders:
This was dope. This was dope. Listen, we gotta was dope. go. We hope you liked this episode. But Moose, final words.
Mostafa Ghonim:
Yeah, I'm gonna say give yourself permission to break the rules, man. Give yourself permission to break the rules like it is okay to do against what has been done traditionally. Again, in today's day and error. It is people who break the rules that are giving themselves an opportunity to get ahead. So don't be afraid to be like, Man, I'm kind of walking outside of my comfort zone outside of what I would normally do. That's okay. All right. You need to be you. Break the rules, be you.
Listen On
