June 21, 2022

Episode 90 - How To Make Your Brand Ideas Come To Life


On today’s episode, Nicky and Moose discuss What’s Poppin’ with former Nike CMO, Greg Hoffman on both authenticity and turning ideas into reality, as well as Don Lemon about the need for vulnerability in business. 

 

Your hosts also break down Nick Cannon and give a fire blueprint for your brand or business to keep it thriving and relevant long after the competition has gone. So, grab your favorite device, share this with a friend, and tune in. This is a can’t miss!

 

What You Will Learn:

  • The importance of authenticity and having a belief system in your brand or business.
  • The significance of the team understanding and experiencing the brand or business’s core values.
  • The need for your audience to see your vulnerability.
  • The benefit of seeing ideas come to life in a certain amount of time.
  • The importance of staying consistent despite what’s new and shiny
  • We can always do more with an opportunity

 

Sponsored By Ecamm Live: An all-in-one live streaming & video production studio. With Ecamm Live, video creation is easy, professional, and fully customizable. If you can think it, you can create it in Ecamm Live. Try it for free www.nickyandmoose.com/ecamm

Transcript

Nicky Saunders  
whats poppin whats poppin whats poppin. Welcome to Nicky and Moose. I'm Nicky that's Moose, whats up Moose?

Mostafa Ghonim  
What up y'all?

Nicky Saunders  
And welcome to episode 90 I'm breaking stuff and everything. Listen, this episode we're gonna be talking about authenticity is cultural currency. We'll get into that bar later. vulnerability, we're talking about what to do with ideas. How to outwork the competition. And more. Right, Moose, how are we feeling about this episode? It's a lot, It's a lot. 

Mostafa Ghonim  
This is like very I feel like very quality content. Intelligent like high vibrational type stuff. Yeah, no, I feel like this is gonna be rich. Yes, this is gonna be rich

Nicky Saunders  
Gone be rich, makes you guys money too. Lets just get into this intro. 

Jaymie Jordan  
Two kids from Queens. Cut from a different cloth. Now joining forces helping you to elevate your personal brand. Yeah, I'm talking about Nicky and moose, bringing you a never before seen perspective. Instead, the mindset, the mentality, the behaviors, the driving force, and more importantly, the stories behind the people and brands that you know love the most.

Nicky Saunders  
And of course, shout out to all our audio listeners, our video viewers, everywhere around the world. Were on the charts in Gambia and Trinidad and Tobago and Saudi Arabia we just Barb's we just we just appreciate your appreciation. We would have never thought that we would be global like that. We never thought about it. I'm just saying

Mostafa Ghonim  
That's vibes, shout out to my people to Saudi Arabia. My uh, Middle Eastern family. long lost cousin over there just like tuning in like, Yo, im listen to the podcast.

right? Because I was like, I don't know. Nobody.

Yeah, that's fire, thats pretty cool. Um, that's pretty cool.

Nicky Saunders  
And of course, you already know this episode is powered by Ecamm live the number one streaming all in one production vibes. Everything that you hear and see of Nicky and Moose is all done on Ecamm with a push of a button. So if you want part of E cam live, you get 14 days for free on us if you just go to www.NickyandMoose.com/ecamm Ecamm, But anyways, Moose How are we feeling?

Mostafa Ghonim  
I feel pretty good. Thanks for asking. I had a good week. Wasn't wasn't too crazy. Like work wise. I actually kind of slowed down on our work stuff a little bit just because, you know, like when you feel a burnout is coming?

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah

Mostafa Ghonim  
it's like, like tickling. Yeah. And I'm like, Yeah, I don't know that. This is the time to push. Like there are times where you just like, Yeah, nah, you gotta push through it. Yeah, this one. I was like, Nah, I don't know that pushing is the right move. So I kind of just like took it easy. Still did what I had to do, but I wasn't trying to like, go crazy for no reason.

Nicky Saunders  
I'll see that. That opens up a whole conversation, this this podcast go somewhere different. We will leave that for the live, we'll leave that word alive. But um, no, that's, that's really dope, that you could acknowledge that a burnout is about to come. Like some people are not that self aware. Um, okay, one one quick question. And then we'll leave it for live or something. But is that because you had several burnouts before? So now, you know, some of this that you're being intentional with understanding the signs?

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yes, certainly. Yeah. Because my my cycles used to be like, really long, meaning I will feel like I'm on top for three months, and then I'm on the bottom for three months. So my goal over the last six, five to seven years was to shorten my cycle. I've been working on it, like, Yo, I gotta shorten my cycle. So now I'm from like, three months to like, you know, three days, maybe three weeks depending on how crazy it could be. But I'm like, shorten that cycle, shorter cycle shorten that cycle. So yeah, I've definitely had my fair share. So I'm trying to avoid it all together right now. This will be the first one that I avoid completely, which I'm praying and I Juke, move and bounce out of it. Yeah.

Nicky Saunders  
Okay, I want to ask questions, but I'm not going to I'm not going to be boom sorry show. Because after show after show after Yeah, join us on the All Access squad on Apple podcast because we do a really dope after show that you guys should, should be listening to. But that's neither here nor there. Um, I feel so that's, that's dope that you're like aware of it because I feel for me, I don't feel like I'm going to a burnout. But I feel like I'm being very intentional with the rest. And being intentional with the like the movements. Not because I feel like a burnout is happening, or about to happen. I think it's just being a learning from before, of, you know, what, what I was doing, and I never really saw, I've never really, but I didn't see progress like I wanted to. So now I think I'm trying out some new things I think with, you know, back when I had COVID. And realizing like not everything is such an emergency, you don't always have to be in front of the computer, you know how to do date. So I'm actually not being in front of the computer all the time. I'm actually not reacting to certain things in the urgency way that I did, but not compromising the work either. So I think I'm just moving with more intentions. Yeah. Yeah,

Mostafa Ghonim  
this is a big season too. So I feel like I think the word they would use is pruning. So I feel like this is the season where you're like being pruned, right. Like, it's, it's almost like a preparation season, there's a lot going on, there's important decisions to make. There's there's things to build and develop. But you also don't want to almost like scatter your energy to things that don't matter. Because you're just not going to have enough juice for the things that do matter. So that's what I'm kind of observing in what you're doing.

Nicky Saunders  
With that. I like that. Let's get into this episode that I'm very excited about because we got really dope clips to talk about and break down. To start it off. Y'all know we love Nike, Nike was a little small sponsorship would be dope. But yes, neither neither here nor there. Nike had a really amazing guy named Greg Hoffman, who used to work, everything marketing, I don't want to mess up his exact title. But he was a big deal, and a marketing genius for Nike. And he was on a recent podcast, I think it's like the diary of a CEO. And he said something about authenticity. For a brand that was so fire, I tweeted it out. So shout out to those people who follow us on Twitter. And so you know where I'm going with this, but let's just play the clip.

Greg Hoffman  
I always use that mantra don't chase cool. Because most likely, you're not going to catch it. And that idea that your authenticity is your cultural currency, the minute your audience can no longer see your original pursuit. And every company is a bit different, is the day they kind of leave you and go, go engage and partner with someone else. It's belief, its mission, its vision, its values, you know, where are you going? How are you going to get there? What do you believe? What's your promise to your audience? And what are the characteristics and traits that compose your brand in that pursuit? To deliver inspiration and innovation to to everyone?

Mostafa Ghonim  
What a word. What a word.

Nicky Saunders  
Let me let me let me start this one off, because this one has hit me for a few days. Okay? A few days. The fact that I tweeted it, meaning it hit me there's I don't really tweet too much. But when I do is because something really got to me and I think it was definitely that authenticity is like cultural currency. And I think with the way the world and society is that couldn't be so truer, regardless of your personal brand, regardless if you're a Nike and Adidas or whatever, because you authenticity keeps us connected with you. And I love how he said once that goes away, there's a disconnect, we're going to search for another one that is we can feel like we can connect with, we could feel like there's something in it for us as well. We, we tend to just look at the products and services. And what we have to offer too much and put too much bank on that. Where sometimes it's just about being transparent. Sometimes it's about being just real, whether it's about our environment, or backgrounds or culture, our viewpoints, like literally people follow and buy from brands based off what they say and do and who they really are. If you don't believe in anything, it's you feel hollow, you're like a hollow brand. You don't have substance, there's nothing you really stand on. There's nothing about you we can really rock with. So the more authentic you are, the more you have validation, the more you have acceptance in culture. And I think that's so valuable because we hear authenticity very often. We've spoken about it on on the podcast so many times, right. And now we're hearing it from a standpoint of making an equal to currency. And it's like, Hold on, wait, what does that mean? Wait. So like, we're actually valued more? Because we're authentic? Like, because I can be who I am. And you're saying that my value goes up? Absolutely. Because it's rare, because we expect you to sell the product and the services in a certain kind of way and only focus on that, but what about the value it brings to your customers? What about the beliefs that it holds? What about the, the, the ethic that it has around? Like, what about all these things that we tend to just pass by it? And then we're wondering why we're not having customers swipe their cards, or customers going to our events? And and, you know, even from a smaller standpoint of sharing our content and clicking on our websites, why aren't people doing these things? You almost have to tap in and be like, well, am I really showing who I really am? Am I really showing what this brand is really about? So the fact that he's saying authenticity is, is what's bringing cultural currency. I was like,

Mostafa Ghonim  
love Yeah, yeah. That's a good word. Because it's like we, when I think about what are the things that I'm into, for the things that I enjoy, is something that captivates not just my attention, but it captivates my heart, right? Like there's meaning to it's like, Yo, there's a soul tie, there's a connection there. So anything but authenticity is hollow. Like, it may look nice on the outside, it may have an appeal, but I think it's one of those things where it's, it's enjoyment doesn't last long, you get it for a little bit, but it doesn't last like it just wears off really fast. So I like that approach where it's almost an not an exchange, but but a way that you can monetize or have some form of value, like being built up just for bringing that to the table like you that can be looked at as value. And you can get value the part that I also want to bring attention to as well, because I think you spoke to the authenticity piece. So dope is the parts of the traits, the characteristics, those definitions and principles that he talked about to make up a phenomenal company and brand like that. That's important too, right? Like that part is something that a lot of us need to think about, beyond our marketing and beyond our content and beyond on beyond what we're going to tell people, what is the essence of what we believe those are like those corny, cheesy little conversations that people sometimes overlook and say, Oh, that's just something that you put on the wall that looks as a like a wannabe motivational mission statement or a core value, but in actuality, great companies, they not only have those things defined, they also live them out. They're really intentional about living out certain things. So one of the Wonder brands or companies of course that comes to mind is tom toms the shoe company right for every pair they sell They donate a pair. I don't know if they're as popular today. But I know for a time, that was something that almost brought them more money, because they stay true to something that they believed in, which is, hey, let's make sure people in need have shoes on their feet. So that's definitely a second part of that, that I think everyone should pay attention to, if you don't have a greater mission behind your company, your brand, or your business, create one, if you don't have certain stories, or people that you really want to captivate and serve, sit down and think about them, like, what's that thing that drives you, so that you can have a greater reason for why you're doing all of this, because at the end of the day, if you're just doing the work to do the work, it's gonna run out, like, I'll tell you a quick story today. And this would be the last thing that we did. When I got on a little late, I was at a store with a friend of mine. And we waited forever to get to the cashier to checkout. So finally we get to the line. And he's like, feeling extra friendly and bubbly today, and he says to the lady at the register, like, how was your day? She's like, Oh, really good. Thank you so much for asking. It's been this busy all day. Right? And like the lion was was crazy. And then she says, but I like it this way. It makes time pass by faster.

Nicky Saunders  
Facts

Mostafa Ghonim  
And then I was like, yo is that broken Thinking? Like, if you think about it, time is our greatest commodity. Why are we trying to make something that is of the most important to us in our life, pass by so fast? Is it because we're doing something that is not meaningful to us, like we've accepted to do things that are not meaningful to us? So we're trying to just rush through that phase, to get to a little bit of whatever's left? I don't know. It just fascinated me today. And I was like, Yo, that shows you the importance of why we need to build things that we believe in, and really be intentional with what we're devoting our time to. So we never have to spend a day working on our brand our business and then say, oh, yeah, I like it this way. It just makes time pass by faster. I don't know if I want to just pass I don't like I don't I want to enjoy it. I want to you don't say like, I want to soak it up. So I don't know that that that just for some reason registered with me differently. I'm like, yeah, no, that's not how I want to how I want to pass my time, like, I want to, I want my time to stay on forever.

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah, I mean, that that goes with, you're not really in the place that you want to be anyways. So you're trying to speed up that time, in order to get to where you really want to go, which maybe for that person it was home, you know, and I don't know what happens over at home, maybe she works on what she really wants, and maybe she works on a passion there. And she just rest, you know, um, but I actually have a question where, when, when he was talking about, you know, the values and the beliefs and everything of a brand? How important is it for everyone on the team to understand it? Right, because in that interview, he spoke on that and was like, you know, that's something that gets brushed upon, like, quickly, right. And so not everybody on the team may understand those things. And you stated earlier, you know, some people have it on the walls and things like that. But how important it is, is it for teams to, to have that, like understands,

Mostafa Ghonim  
it's cool if they have the understanding, but I realized most people won't understand it until they actually see it as part of your operations. So in certain businesses that I'm a part of, we reward behaviors we want to see. So if we have a value, or we believe in, say, quality service, then or say treat everyone equally or fairly, then we're going to highlight the individual who's treating people with quality of service and treating everyone equally, we're going to reward them for that behavior, we're going to speak to it as this is why it's important. And this is why we're highlighting it because it's one of the things that we believe in. So I find that if you just say it, or if you just make it a point for everyone to understand it. Some people may get it, some people may not. And the reason why everyone is not going to get it because we're all moved by different things. But the minute that your team starts to see that you act out on your beliefs, the things that you say mattered to you. They're a part of your operations. They're a part of your daily practice. They're a part of your decision making process. They guide you toward what decisions you make and what you don't make. Everyone says oh, we want impact over income. Everyone says that there are two words that rhyme with that start with the eye. They rhyme it sounds real cool and fun. But But how many people actually do that? Very few. So I think that it's cool if they have the understanding they're going to learn when they see you acting out, like when you carry out those beliefs and really love them out loud.

Nicky Saunders  
That makes sense. But we can't talk about authenticity and values and beliefs without talking about vulnerability. And there was a new episode of the shop. And, of course, they talked about, you know, as celebrities as influencers, how important is it to be vulnerable? And what's his name? Don, What's his last name?

Mostafa Ghonim  
I forget, but I believe he's on CNN. He's an he's

Nicky Saunders  
the only the only black guy on prime time. But he said this, I'm gonna get his name. Don't don't clip this up and say that I don't know his name and get this name. By the time you finish this, this clip.

Don Lehman  
You guys are supposed to be up there and like, not break down not show emotion it well, no, no, who says that? Well, traditionally, right. And you don't live in a Walter Cronkite society. We live in a different world right now. And there didn't used to be people who look like me. Yep. Right? You have a gay black man? Who is the only I'm the only black person in primetime on cable. Right? So if I don't say it, if I'm not vulnerable, if I don't speak for my people, and from my perspective, then who am I?

Nicky Saunders  
And I got it. It's Don Lehman. Got that?

Mostafa Ghonim  
There it is. Yeah, no, I love that. I love that is so true. It's it's kind of what I've been speaking about the last few episodes here and saying that I'm I'm walking more proudly into my faith, because it's the thing that makes me me. So when you especially when you feel underrepresented, and I connect with what he's saying, right? He's saying, I am the only black male, of i guess he also identifies as gay. So it's like, you're the only person. So if you don't say it, no one will speak for you. It is rare that you get someone who's willing to sacrifice their career, their profession, their calling, to advocate on your behalf, right. And most times, people will not do that, until they recognize and understand your experience. So what how are they going to understand you got to speak it. So I totally understand that or just kind of see the importance of it is, may you have to uncover or dig up the parts of you that you are hiding. And think about ways to reveal them to the world where people can better understand them. And please keep this in context. It's not, it's not a competition of comparing broken narratives. It's not about we said this on the live ones, it's not about showing the greatest scars or the most pain and wanting people to, to see that. It's, it's more about providing an understanding, to provide to provide some level of context to show the transgression or the transformation, or to show the truth of what it really is not what people think it is. So those are pieces that you should be thinking about, even either in your brand story, your business story, even in your personal self, pieces of you that you can reveal to people where they can better understand you. Because when understanding is present, so as Grace, if I understand you, I'm automatically going to extend grace to your experience without you having to make me feel bad or telling me here's why this is like no, I understand Nicky identifies with this type of situation, or she's been through this type of thing. So I can offer grace the audience, they'll offer grace, they'll back you, they'll be in your comments kind of rooting for you and telling you like, Hey, don't worry about that. I know you've had some experiences about that as well, where you would actually miss anything the audience is in there, almost back and you because they already know. But if you would have never said anything or you never tell them and you're hiding things that matter, right? And things like our faith or our beliefs, our our our thoughts, our values, all of these things. People don't know they might attack you although you're someone who's supposed to be defending them. So yeah, that that part is just like the great embrace, man walk into those things that you often feel pressure to hide.

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah, and I liked that. He said Like, it's not, people don't expect you to be all put together, regardless of certain titles, certain statuses, you know, and, and just like how Moose said and how Don said, it's like yo, he is the only prime time black anchor right now, like right now, right? bump the you know, of course, that he's gay and everything like that he wanted to emphasize I'm the only black person. So what I have to say about certain things that are happening, or that are not happening in society right now, it matters. Like, I have to show them how I feel about it, I have to give my perspective on it, because there's no one else that can speak on it. And the way that the world has been is we seek for voices just like us. He's respected because of the point of views that he give his his his views on things. Because he looks like us, he sounds like us, you know, he, um, he may have gone through some things or has family members or have gone through some things. There's no other people that are speaking on these different topics the way he is. And that goes towards just influencers and people with status. In general, we seek for for the vulnerability we seek for their point of views on things, because they are our voice on certain topics, certain cultural situations, you know, certain hobbies, whatever it is, they are the voice that we don't have. And so we root for them, we we sometimes criticize them, but we root for them. And we want them to continue to say what they are now there's going to be backlash, regardless, because where one side wants, wants them to stay and wants to hear it. There's other people that don't. And that is the pros and cons of being vulnerable. Thats the pros and cons of of giving your all and saying how you feel about things, there's going to be people who don't care and don't want to hear it. But the good in it speaks louder than that. Because it is important, regardless of how big or small your influence may be, you are the voice for somebody. And before it was, you could only look this certain kind of way and have these amount of degrees and hat know these people in order to have a opportunity to speak into the mic. Now it's like, no, you have you can say it, however you want to say it on a platform you can own or that has hired you for these particular things. But they mainly listen to you because of who you are based off the authenticity and the vulnerability that has almost needs to be the new requirement on some of these job descriptions.

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yes, good. Yeah,

Nicky Saunders  
just say true. Now going into teams and ideas, this one, this part, I feel like I'mma go in on, because this is really dope and I should have made the first clip. But Gavin will be excited about this one. So going back to Greg Hoffman, marketing genius of Nike, right? He talked about things that help teams and what you should do with ideas. And ya know, I've been on this journey of what's next and and all these new ideas and everything like that. So this excites me. So let's hear it

Greg Hoffman  
Makes sure that you were incentivized to take risks. You had the space to be able to present ideas that may not be on the plan. And you had a receptive executive team that was willing to hear from you either build internally, or have a relationship with an agency that can take your conversations and the ideas you have and quickly visualize them in a visceral way. So, and you've heard it before a picture, says 1000 words, I would walk out of those conversations over and over again, I'd walk over to the visualization team. And I said, let's, let's come back to the team and surprise them in three days, with either an image or a short GIF, or a film, or even oftentimes, an app prototype that was working. If I didn't do that, then more often than not, you might forget that the conversations ever happen.

Nicky Saunders  
First and foremost, I'm applying that right now. Literally, text, my team saying, hey, Mondays, we're leaving it a part of the conversation of just ideas that you guys have. And we're going to be doing the pros and cons of it, you know, but speak openly about some of the things that you have. Right? Um, I'm putting that right now, like that first part is what has made his team in Nike so successful. So if he says that I'm doing that, right, yeah. Um, the second part, where you live, you literally, there's two parts to it, literally make the idea of visual in like, a few days just to see how possible this could be. I never thought about that. That's good. I never thought yo with the idea. You may not like because I think when we think of ideas, it's like, okay, how do I execute on it? And it's not truly a thing until it's executed. But sometimes, you just have to see it, like, see that? It's possible. Because it's a thought, right? It's not nothing, we could touch or see anything besides what's in our head. So to literally have a visualization team, I've never heard about it, like, Alright, let me get your ideas, boom, here. But this to life real quick, this may happen, this may not happen. But you can at least see what your idea looks like. And we could, you know, fix it up in the, you know, in the execution phase of it. But this is what it could possibly look like. Do you know how many ideas get dropped, because we don't speak on it no more, because there was never a next step. And in that interview, he was like, there's, there's a few reasons there's like, one, there was no ownership. But two, there wasn't even a sight of it. Like, you don't literally see the idea that's in your head. But that doesn't mean anything. And I'm like, Okay, so with these Monday meetings, we're going to pick what ideas the best that we're going to agree on. And then we're going to put that we're going to visualize, we're going to show it, right, somehow, some way. And I, it could go back towards like even what's the vision boards? Right? That's where it's like, okay, let's speak into exhibit, let's show it. It goes with that kind of concept. But I never, I never put it from a thought process of business. And the ideas for business, how are we? How are we making it, it come to life, but also for a team to see it? You know, because as leaders or aspiring leaders, we're always going to know what it looks like, we're always going to see the direction that it needs to go, and things like that. And sometimes the communication gets lost because it's all in here in the team, so it's not even from the person who comes up with the idea. It's more of the team, seeing what you see. Or having the person on the team clearly see, the whole team sees it. And it's like, not only did you hear my idea, but you actually made it come to life. So now I feel a bit valued on the team. Because you took it You didn't just like okay, cool, thank you. Next person. No, like you took it and you actually made it into something Now that that adds a little bit of like a confidence as well as acceptance of that and value of that team player on some like, okay, like, I'm heard I have a voice. And I can admit that my my stubborn ways is like, No, I don't think that's a good idea. Now I'll shut things down. I'll say No, before I say yes, very easily. But I think with this way, if I can visually see something, and we all agree on it, or majority wins. Like, I think it could help not only open my mind to certain possibilities, but the team's mind of possibilities, because it's, I want to invest in a visualization team. Now. I don't really I didn't even know that existed, but I want to invest in it. So yeah, people if you if you want to be part of this visualization team. Just hit me up. Because I'm serious about this, like I want if you if you know how to take an idea and make it come to life, just from step one of just making it graphically look right understand the third website, whatever. I don't even want to say it's a graphic designer, because he said app, I was like, that's not a graphic designer. But three days, in three days, Ill give you four because you know, this Nike, Nike got a different bag, they can they can make that happen in in three days. I'm gonna say four, Feel me?

Mostafa Ghonim  
That's next level. Yeah, no, I heard so many. So many things in that though, right? It's like, if you're a leader, and you're the only one who can see the vision, or the vision is in your head. It does no one else any good.

Nicky Saunders  
Yep.

Mostafa Ghonim  
You're the only one who can see the vision or the vision is in your head as the leader, it does no one any good. Because they just can't understand or comprehend what you're trying to accomplish. The other part that I heard, because I love what you what you mentioned, right? Like, just the concept of bringing things to life little by little, but this other piece of, a lot of people think being a leader is being a boss. You know, you know that in the Arabic language? Boss, the word the word for boss is teacher.

Nicky Saunders  
Really?

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yeah. Yeah, at least in my native language as, as someone from Egypt, the word bosses, we would say myelin. Myelin is a teacher. Right? Someone who teaches you're not, you're not a boss in the sense of like, Yo, I bet. So boom, now you go over there. You do this. Like, that's not a that's not always the that's not always how a boss needs to move.

Nicky Saunders  
Right.

Mostafa Ghonim  
When stuff hit the fan, by all means, the one who's the best leader, the one who understands all the moving pieces probably needs to step in a really quarterback to ship especially in a time of crisis. But think about that. The word for boss in the different languages teacher and for me, I'm just as I'm listening to him talk, shout out to my guys, audio settings. By the way, Eddie, can I get his audio settings? I'm listening to him. And I'm like, yo, this dude is phenomenal. Like, I don't know if it's his voice. I don't know if it's his audio settings or something. I think that's the same mic.

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah.

Mostafa Ghonim  
I mean, I think there's audio said he's Eddie, but but it's just like, I'm thinking about, you know, how selfless a true leader really is. You know, you gotta let your people feel that they're the ones accomplishing that their voices are being heard, that their in visions and ideas are, are brought into the table. Even if you have the answer, you know, how would you solve this? What should we do here? Right. And it's the responsibility of people on the team that if you're asked to provide input, because I noticed sometimes people on the teams be like hmm, so what do you think let's just pass you the ball. Why are you throwing it back to me? So it's like, I know both sides exist, but I'm just I really love what he's saying here about some of these concepts. And what I'm hearing is like, you know, be selfless. Be more of a teacher like being a boss and a leader just because you own it doesn't always mean this stuff that we see on TV and on shows. It's not it's not always had a boss needs to move. There is a different way to move, which is to empower your people and make them feel fulfilled in the process of bringing your vision to life or bringing the company mission to life, because it's not like his his company, my man works for Nike. So like, all of us need to feel that. So I feel like, we can all benefit more from being selfless.

Nicky Saunders  
Right, and I think, um, I don't even like using the word boss, I think I rarely say, boss, right?

Mostafa Ghonim  
Oh never. 

Nicky Saunders  
Right? Because I think

Mostafa Ghonim  
I just say it here to make people feel bad.

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah. Boss has has. Now of course, it's all about the narrative that you give it. Right? But I feel that a leader does things differently. Like it's a, how do I want to say this? I feel like just from a simple standpoint, it's you, you lead the people, but that can mean so many different things. Like, you can lead them by giving them the space to be them on a creative way, on a skills way. Right? You can lead them to, you know, financial freedom, you can lead them into just acceptance of who they are like there, it doesn't mean pushing them around. And you know, that I think that's the definition that I get with a boss is that person that stands back and like, you do this, you do that you do this, and it's not. It's not really team like,

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yeah yeah no for sure, for sure. 

Nicky Saunders  
But, um, but a leader, with, especially with this method is like, and I love what you said, those people that are like more on the what I mean, would you want to like, I'm just here, like, the supportive type shout out to those who are just a supportive type. I think this is this way, will trigger some creative thought, and acceptance of the creative thought, regardless of how much, you know, maybe people don't speak up, because they may feel that it won't be accepted, or that it sounds dumb, or whatever it may be. But if we're creating an environment of just open mindedness of like, No, nothing's dumb, let's just go with, you know, what's the best for the company? You know, what, what can actually be done with the resources that we have? And just really pick out the pros and cons from a factual standpoint, I think that will allow people to open up more and make decisions or make, you know, give their opinions on different things. And you know, and for those, those people who don't know, I've worked with a whole bunch of people in that supportive role. And it can be frustrating from a person who makes decisions and comes up with ideas, it can be very frustrating, but I've been on this road of taking responsibility. And like, Have I been? Have I just expected them to come up with ideas? Or have I really have I really created a space that allows them to say, whatever they want to say, and we try it out for real for real, and allow facts to be the determining factor and not how we feel about it, or what we think give me like, so. I like making it come to life. I really want to apply that I really want to figure out different ways that doesn't add extra stress to nobody. It's like Alright, cool. Let's make that come to life. It's like wait, so hold on. 

Mostafa Ghonim  
For sure, I'm already I already got a lot of work. Yeah, yeah. Just two things that I can add to real quick before we go on to the next one. Number one, everyone listening to this man study how other business models or business industries go about their product development, right, a lot of us in the service and creative world because we don't have something physical that we hold in our hands. It's usually digital or something We put online, we don't think about creating some form of sample template, just as he's talking about the app, right? Because if you think about other models, if you're in the clothing industry, you never mass produce before you get samples. If you if you if you're if you're creating something physical, you usually never mass produce before you get a sample and you look at it, hey, okay, is the design centered? Is it this? Or do we want to make the lettering a little smaller, a little bigger? Do we want to ship Do I like the material? Right, so study different industries, or different verticals, because it will show you what comes first in their process. And maybe you can take something into that just as we're talking. And he mentioned the app, I'm like, Man, Apple kind of showed their cars all along, because anytime they put out an iOS, like a new iOS, they're always putting out a beta version, they always put out a beta version first. So it I love the talk, because it's just like, it's like what they say when you get a new car, and you start seeing everywhere, it's like now that we're talking about it, I'm noticing like, yeah, not for nothing. A lot of the more successful companies are doing this in some facet, whether it be a physical or a digital product. So just with what you're saying, I do think we need to really adopt that mentality. But certainly think about how other industries go about bringing or just development in general, because there are some things that we can take into it. And lastly, as it relates to the people side of things, we can't, we can't put so much pressure on our people to want them to succeed. But we never accept when they fail. That part needs to be encouraged. If you're working with somebody, you have to make it okay for them to fail, especially if you feel that they're more of a supportive behind the scenes person doesn't want too much responsibility or just doesn't want to break something. There's some level of fear or intimidation with what's happening, encourage them to fail. Because the minute they see that they're not going to get in trouble for failing, they're actually going to try. And that's where the magic sauce, what happens with that group that's usually on the sidelines like that.

Nicky Saunders  
In fact, I actually wanted to double back on the the apple thing, because they actually do the visualization, then the beta, then the real thing, because on the keynote, when they do their events, we see what it looks like, right? To test it out doesn't happen till probably a couple of weeks later, or a couple of days later, right? So you see what it is you get excited about it, oh my god, this could possibly happen. Then there's a beta group. And then it's the real life updates. And of course, Nothing's ever perfect. So that continues to get updated. And I think that's that speaks a lot about an idea to like, even when it's out to the world. That doesn't mean that's the final product. You can always give different versions of it different upgrades to it. And but it starts with the idea to then showing it to then testing it to then putting it out and understanding this is not just the final version. So, yeah no shout out to Apple because Apple really gives the blueprint all day.

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yeah, for real. 

Nicky Saunders  
All day, And we’re already at 50min  alright okay, so, listen, right. Ah, this next clip, right, this next clip and may be our last one Sheesh. Um, shout out to Nick Cannon because Nick Cannon doesn't get enough props for his business, his work ethic and what he does behind the scenes. You know, people know him for various reasons. But there's one brand that we can't like when you say Nick Cannon, you can't say Nick can without saying this brand, which is Wild N Out. I think it was like a year or two ago, there was some issues of that. It really wasn't his, Was it his? like there was this big confusion. And he was recently on the Joe Budden podcast talking about Wild N Out. And one of the things that I got out of it was just putting your head down and working and the results that it creates. So lets listen to it.

Nick Cannon  
My competition was punked. It was me and Ashton Kutcher, and that was the one that they held up and they embraced him so they like, let Nick do his lil thing. We got punked, outlasted them then they got another guy that they got really excited about like, Oh, we got ridiculousness. Like another one of those. Thats cool, but the whole time I'm over here quiet, grinding, and then they look up and it's a billion dollar brand has many verticals. From touring, from brick and mortar merchandise, gaming, restaurants. Like so none of their other brands have done that still their number one digital brand to this day is Wild N  Out.

Mostafa Ghonim  
Man. Yeah. What does Jay say? men lie, women lie numbers don't. And I just think anytime that that numbers are a part of the conversation, everyone shuts up, whatever debate is going on about who's the best and who's not the best the minute, someone can have their numbers in there proof like that. That's phenomenal. But we can't also talk numbers without addressing the obvious, which is what he did to produce the numbers. And to your point about the work ethic, the consistency, regardless of what was happening in his life. And there have been many different reasons why we could we even know about Nick Cannon through different other formats, right? Whether it be his personal life, his love life, his children, his this, there are other things that we know about him. But when you think about the spite of all of that, his brand, or that the Walmart brand is where it's at, that shows you the level of focus, consistency, discipline, drive, that somebody's got to have to be able to deal with those things, but still keep something running the way it is. So that it just goes back to the intangibles like we saw in the beginning, it was authenticity and vulnerability. And now you're seeing some more of those traits and characteristics here that you need to infuse into yourself. Before you see it manifest into your brand. And even the revenue of your business or what it's producing. Like, you got to really double down on you. So that even if you're not getting the attention, when the conversation does come up, it's undisputable. Like oh, wow. I didn't know. I had no idea. But I can't ignore the fact that these numbers are present. Because reports data, everything will come back and show me what even what I didn't know. So that Yeah, I can't even say anything else about that that's incredible.

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah, this hits home. So I'm gonna say in different way. So, um, so what I like about this was there's you you see the new shiny object, right? At what he said was punked and ridiculousness, right? Oh, we got punked. We got ridiculousness. We're gonna put our energy to that we're gonna put we see you. But you do whatever you want. Right? Now, other people can get very discouraged. Right, like, other people get very discouraged, like, am I getting the attention? I'm not, you know, I'm not getting the same exposure I'm not doing they're not giving me the same energy. But what he did was like literally put his head down and was like, I'm going, I'm going in, I'm going in. I'm gonna build this. And then the fact that he said, Yo, I got, you know, brick and mortar, I got a digital product. I got merchandise. I got gaming. I got like, first off, I didn't know. Like, I actually saw a while and out like, spot. And I was like, I'm so confused. What does that even mean? What do they come there? Do they not? Like what's what's happening? Right? Um, but he built that to where it's like, hold up. We need a part of that. Right? You have all ownership of this. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, hold on. We we got to figure this out. Because you're actually still going while these other two are gone. Yeah, well, I think one is still running but

Mostafa Ghonim  
Ridiculousness might be still on for sure

Nicky Saunders  
Yeah, i think that's still running. But regardless, um, they're not they don't have the same amount of of popularity as it used to. While now Still going still going strong on tour and everything. And it's like, hold on. We need a part of that somehow some way. Because you're on our platform. Right, right. So, in, in that same interview, he was like, yep. So we came to an agreement that, you know, that makes me comfortable. That makes me comfortable. Right? Right, that makes me comfortable. And then he also spoke about, you know, I think he, I think he did give up 50%. And was like, you know, what, they're going to now give the energy it needs, they're going to get bigger, and I'm okay with doing that. Because now my team can chill out a little bit. And let this team take it to new heights. And it brings up several things for me, one, regardless of what you may think you deserve, or how much energy should be put into you, you still have to have your own base, you still have to have your own thing going on. Because you're the one that has the dream, you're the one that sees the potential of it. And so, though it may not be being grown as fast as others, it's still growing, because you're putting energy to it, and never to get too discouraged that it stops, right. But when they finally do see what it's worth, when people finally do recognize how dope you are, you have to put yourself in certain situations where you only get in partnerships or, or situations that is going to elevate what you've already done on your own. Not something that you feel like it's owed to them because you're on their platform. But you clearly see Oh, snap, they are about to take me to whole new heights. This makes sense. And financially wise, it makes sense. Exposure wise, leverage wise, it all makes sense now. But that possibly couldn't have happened if he would have been like, oh, you spending more time with punked And you're spending more time with ridiculousness. Like it could have been just a pilot that could have failed But he was like, Nah, we gone and the the real great thing about Wild N Out, it was literally a platform in order to put his friends on. Let me highlight some of the other great comedians and stand up artists And let me put them here and show the world how dope they are. And he continues to do that. Like we know what we're talking about relevant stuff, like a DC young fly, because of Wild N Out. Yeah. We know of a b Simone because of Wild N Out pretty V because of Wild N Out, you know, or plays a factor in that. And so to come from pure intentions of let me put people on and building it and believing it more than maybe others would. And then finally being in a position where they see what you do and want to be a part of it And making strategic moves based off what other people can do not because they felt like they had to or anything. I think Nick Cannon needs more flowers than he really gets. Because that's that. That whole movement for it to be a billion dollar brand to have such different components of Wild N Out which seems just like a really dope comedic show to, Oh no we're touring. No, we got merchandise. We got this. We got that we got like, it's very inspiring. It's very inspiring. And it shows a lot of what putting your head down and working does feel me?

Yeah, that's major. Yeah, the fact that he's accomplished all of those things simultaneously. Diversified a brand built the brand put his people on made a name for himself. You It is like there's so many things that have happened under that one roof which is just shows that we can always do more with an opportunity once an opportunity is whatever is in our hands we can always do more with it that's a perfect example guy took something that could be any stand up to I don't know I don't know if any stand up towards that he made a billion but the fact that he can get that valuation out of it that's incredible. 

this people let us know what you think of this episode. Follow us on all social media channels Nicky and Moose. Thats what it is. And of course, this episode is powered by Ecamm live if you want to try Ecamm live after 14 days for free on us just go to www.NickyandMoose.com/ecamm and get your 14 days for free. Moose, final words.

Mostafa Ghonim  
Yeah, nothing deep man but take care of you imma be honest physical, mental, spiritual, you can change the scenery and move from one home to another one part one apartment to another but you're still going to live in your same body so take care of you.