Welcome to the third episode of Nicky and Moose the Podcast! Today Nicky Saunders And Mostafa Ghonim are highlighting the one and only Jennifer Lopez! The dancer, singer, actress, fashion designer, and businesswoman has, without question, laid out a compelling business and branding blueprint. But how did she go from Jenny from the block to internationally renowned entertainer and 8-figure earner?
Join us today as we breakdown the mentality and behaviors that have made J. Lo’s nearly 30-year career so successful. We’ll also dive into what we can do in our own brands and businesses that will set us on the path to reaching new heights in our industries.
What you will discover:
-Is a college degree still relevant today?
-When to shift from working harder than everyone else to outworking others strategically
-How much energy to give projects
-Working because it’s worth it
-Does work ethic translate to personal life?
-Don’t expect people to be like you
-What support looks like
-What to do when you’ve reached an unprecedented level of success — Discovery Phase
-Who to bring up with you
Nicky Saunders 0:00
What's poppin? What's poppin? What's poppin? Welcome to Nicky and Moose! I'm Nicky! That's Moose! What up Moose?
Mostafa Ghonim 0:07
What up y'all?
Nicky Saunders 0:08
And yo, we're going to be talking about the one, the only the Puerto Rican goddess herself, Jennifer Lopez, Jenny from the Block, J, Lo, all that great stuff.
Moose, how are you feeling about her real quick?
Mostafa Ghonim 0:28
Fire man! I'm just I'm just listening to the length of the career, the many different moves, navigating through some personal issues and still ending up with a ridiculous net worth right now is dope man. You're talking about somebody who's continuing to thrive at, you know, well into her 50s. So that's that's unheard of.
Nicky Saunders 0:51
Listen, she's 50. We'll get into all that. Let's get into the intro.
Jaymie Jordan 0:58
Two kids from Queens...cut from a different cloth. Now, joining forces helping you to elevate your personal brand. Yeah, I'm talking about Nicky and Moose, bringing you a never before seen perspective into the mindset, the mentality, the behaviors, the driving force, more importantly, the stories behind the people and brands that you know and love the most.
Nicky Saunders 1:27
So first off, first off, let's start off with air horns.
Wake up! Whether you're driving, whether you're at the crib, I just wanted you to wake up real quick. Two: I want to apologize, right? I want to apologize because we didn't go over what we thought Rick Ross was going to be. Right? Shout out to to everybody who pointed it out like, "So, are you guys gonna break down the flight assessment for Rick Ross?" Okay, we're gonna do a real, real quick. I promise you real, real quick just because we didn't. You down Moose?
Mostafa Ghonim 2:09
I'm, with it. Let's go for it.
Nicky Saunders 2:10
All right. All right. So look, for those who are listening, right, we have the characters up. We're gonna break it down as far as what we don't think Rick Ross is and we're gonna do process of elimination. Okay? So, whose turn is it to figure out what's what?
Mostafa Ghonim 2:31
It's yours on this one.
Nicky Saunders 2:32
It's mine. Man! Okay.
Man. Um, okay, so I'm going to go with our typical. I do not believe that my man is a grounds crew.
Nah, he's not that. He's not that. Moose, what you got?
Mostafa Ghonim 3:02
I'm gonna say that he is not
an air traffic control.
Nicky Saunders 3:07
Wait, I didn't even do the suspense. Hold on.
I'm so late. I'm so late.
Mostafa Ghonim 3:16
No air traffic control.
Nicky Saunders 3:18
Wait, no. Oh, man. This may not be the right episode to do all this. Because I don't know if I could agree with you on that. Because my man is super strategic. What do you mean? Okay, whatever. All right, look, I think he Mm hmm.
Mostafa Ghonim 3:33
I'm sure there's some element of it there. But it's just so inspired by the extroverted tendencies to go on. I'm a wake up in the morning and show you my breakfast and promote at least nine of my brands. I'm like, Yeah, but that's just just an extroverted way to, to, you know, to strategically express what's happening. So I'm like okay.
Nicky Saunders 3:55
All right. All right. All right. All right. So, all right. I'm going to say... Okay, so my man's flashy. I'm trying to hurry this up. Because I know people are like, what is this? We're gonna get into it, I promise you. But, I'm Rick Ross is super flashy. But in all in all a whole boss, right? I still say he's very strategic, but very loud at the same time as far as how he promotes his brands and businesses. But if I had to pick one, I would say a typical he's the boss. He's a leader. Very like about his business. I will have to say...pilot. He's a pilot. He's a pilot. Yeah.
Mostafa Ghonim 4:57
Yeah. I totally agree. Totally agree. Yeah, definitely a healthy amount of flight attendant in there. You know? But it's driven by Okay. What do we do? Like what's the what's the, the incentive or the return behind it?
Nicky Saunders 5:13
Right. So let me bring them back up and get rid of them. I promise you, we're gonna get into that super promise you however, umm Moose, I'm going to Atlanta and I don't even know if this is the right time.
Mostafa Ghonim 5:29
Oh, talk about it! And this is the first time and I don't know if the podcast people have been up on this. So let me kind of fill you in real quick. Nicky, when was the last time you've left let's just say your community? The community where you live, right? Because I know it's been a long hot minute.
Nicky Saunders 5:47
Yeah. It would probably have to be right when COVID started. So we were in London, when COVID got really serious. And literally the day after I got back home, they did a stay home order. And I have not. And I literally been staying home. I literally. Yeah, no, seriously, I haven't really left anywhere. I think I went to the supermarket, maybe twice in this whole time. I go for walks. But you know, I don't really go anywhere. So I'm going to Atlanta tomorrow well October 17, depending on when you hear this or see this right? And I'm going in and out like I'm not playing games like, I'm gonna go get there, do the event. Not even chill. And so this is where the problem hits. Because I don't know how I'm going to act because I haven't seen people. So I don't know if I'm going to be like, Hey, how are you? Oh, right. Or I'm going to be like, pound that out. Let me do what I need to do. And then I'm out. Eat, because I am going I am eating at Copeland's. Shout out to Copeland's. Fire spot! It's a New Orleans spot that's in Atlanta. But, um, I am eating there, but, um, yeah, I don't I don't know how I feel about this. I don't know.
Mostafa Ghonim 7:15
Yeah, I could already tell you is there's gonna be an awkward pause. Because on the two trips that I've taken, when you first see people, you're like, Oh, you do the awkward hug. But like, do I shake your hand? Do I do I? Do I give you the elbow?
Nicky Saunders 7:29
But I'm a hugger? I am such a hugger.
Mostafa Ghonim 7:33
And if you want to do it, you're not sure if the other person is going to receive it or if they're open to it. So you're like, Okay, how paranoid what's your level of paranoia with COVID right now? And you? Yeah, yes. It's a nice little dilemma. But once you once you break the ice, I think you'll be good because you'll kind of go Okay, you you go with it. I could I could rock out. Where your mask. Yeah don't play games.
Nicky Saunders 7:55
I'm gonna wear my mask, but like I was looking at the behind the scenes situation. And they weren't like once they got comfy, they weren't wearing... like, I don't think anybody in Atlanta is really chillin with the mask right now. I don't know. They feel super comfy. But I've seen numbers go up like there was a report. But numbers are always going up. But still, but New York is staying steady. They said like New York and like five other states are staying steady. Clearly my state isn't staying steady. And Atlanta is not staying steady. So I'm just going to be at risk. I just I'm just going to be at risk. This is what it is.
Mostafa Ghonim 8:35
Yeah. No Be careful. Be careful.
Yeah, for sure. Because when I when I came back last week, I just my, my connecting flights were out of Atlanta. And when I when I flew into New York, just because I was coming off of a plane that stopped in Atlanta, they still sent me I still have to fill out the form. It's like the tracer form they do it at the New York airports.
Nicky Saunders 8:59
Yeah, no. I don't want to I don't want to do that. But let's get into this review. Shout out to everybody who's given us a review. Like seriously, after you hear this episode, or even in the middle of the episode, please leave a review. We're here for this. But Real Estate Rome. Sorry, I already messed that up Real Estate Rome.
Mal is like Make Real Estate Real. So I'm getting confused. Right? So Real Estate Rome said,
"100% gems! Been listening to these two since they started up on Facebook and the way they've broken down people and dissect the business aspect that you can take and use in your own world is amazing. The differing dynamics [I think that's the word] differing dynamics between Nicky and Moose bring a refreshing insight to their unique view points."
Mostafa Ghonim 10:08
Appreciate you Rome!
Nicky Saunders 10:09
Yeah, Real Estate Rome. Hello, hello! We appreciate you. Thank you for leaving a review and shout out to everybody who is leaving a review. We always want to acknowledge the people who show love to us and we're going to show back. But Moose?
Mostafa Ghonim 10:29
Nicky Saunders 10:31
Are we gonna get straight to it?
Mostafa Ghonim 10:33
Yeah, let's roll right into it. Yeah, let's get it.
Nicky Saunders 10:35
So, as you heard in the intro, we are going with... I promise you as a Puerto Rican like J. Lo his look is looked at as a goddess. Like Puerto Rican Day Parade. Like she represents for all the Latinas in the world. Not only is she a female, but she's Puerto Rican. That's just amazing for us. Her and Mark Anthony are the greatest. Now granted, they used to be together. That was amazing time for Puerto Rico. Amazing time! However, you know, things happen. But um, yeah, J. Lo is just a whole beast. So, I think like very first memories of J. Lo was her dancing. Like I still remember that right? Now, granted, the biggest memory is Selena, of course. You know, but um, man the whole Jenny from the Block kind of vibes but just to see actress, R&B, pop singer, right? Like what?
Mostafa Ghonim 11:42
Yeah, that's that's a New York hustle for real. Like you think about when she started? Right? What she had to go through like, there was a little bit of disconnect or like some some turbulence at the house because there was a disagreement between her and her mom when she took on this path. So you talk about someone who just starts off dancing, ambitions to go on Broadway. And then starts practicing the, to become an actor, or an actress, I should say. And she embarks on this journey now and you just look at the different levels that she's taken down throughout her career for almost 30 years now just every every couple years boom, she knocks something out. Then she you know and look we got we got some of her stats right here. Right? Actress, singer, fashion designer, producer. You know? Businesswoman. She's in the fragrance business as well. Now in tech and real estate and built an investment portfolio as an angel investor. Eight albums!
Nicky Saunders 12:44
Hold on! Hold on!
Let's not, let's not pass that. That's crazy. That's crazy.
Mostafa Ghonim 12:52
This is the bigger part too. 39 movies and 3 billion at the box office. That's some Denzel type stuff. Like 39 movies? Yeah. That's a minute.
Nicky Saunders 13:05
Yeah, she...her work ethic is crazy. I mean, and I know, we'll get into it a little bit later, but just the fact that she was doing this pretty much all at the same time. You know, and to have the only person to have a number one album, and a number one movie, at the same time is crazy. Like, how do you stay sane? How do you have kids? How do you have a personal life? How do you like? J. Lo is what, you know, females males too look at is like, yo, that "That woman is different?" Like...
Mostafa Ghonim 13:50
Yeah, you gotta respect it. You gotta respect the grind.
Nicky Saunders 13:53
Crossover from pop and R&B and everything to the Hispanic music. Like, she, um, she's just different. She's, she's just different but, you know, our whole point is not necessarily to break down the albums or break down the movies or anything like that. We're going to look at it from a standpoint of the brand and the business side, we always come in and we take these greats, living legends pretty much, and we break down what we can take from their success, but from a branding and business standpoint. There are other people who could break down their whole career. We ain't here for that. We are not here for that. But we do go based off the flight assessment like we did with Rick Ross. So for those who were a little bit lost, don't worry, we're about to catch you up in a minute and 30 Moose, can you break down which one is which how they act, all that great stuff?
Mostafa Ghonim 14:58
Absolutely. So first and foremost, just know that this is based off of the four dominant personality types that exist in the world. Now we know that while we have all four, there's one of these characters that really becomes the driving factor behind pretty much everything we do. The success that we have. The trouble or the challenges that we run into. So we use the airport theme to show how all of these elements or characteristics can be easily seen in some of the people in your life, in your personal self, and how you can start utilizing some of these things to your advantage in your business and in your personal brand. So first up, we have the pilot, right now what you notice about the pilot, of course, they're sitting in the cockpit focused on getting the plane from where it is to its final destination. So when you look at a pilot, you're typically going to see someone who's just a type goal getter. They love challenges like they they step up and take on the risk that most people are like, dude, sir, ma'am, as Nicky was say, Are you crazy? And they're like, No, I'm not crazy. But yeah, maybe I am, right? So usually, those people that love the challenges, they're very direct, they move extremely fast, and they're all about getting to the next thing. Those are your pilots. Next up, similar to when you're on a plane, you're going to see the flight attendant right now you notice that the flight attendant aura is totally different. It's all about the people. It's all about the the swag, the experience, the energy, right, the personality, the charisma. So those who resonate with a flight attendant, this is someone who's really going to use their gift to build relationships, and influence others as their main driving force behind their success. And then next up, you then have the grounds crews, right, the people in the orange, the blue, the green vest, they have their hands in a lot of different places, right, they're getting the bags on the plane, they are bringing up beverages and snacks to the flight attendants, they're helping to back the plane onto the runway or to the gate. So they're involved in a lot of different areas. But typically, what you see from them is that they're super patient, they're not necessarily concerned with wanting to be in the limelight. But they're loyal to a vision, right? They're loyal to a team, they want to be a part of something that's bigger than themselves, and they care about the collective winning. And then last but not least, you have the air traffic control, right? Still a critical point or a critical part in the overall experience of getting your plane from where it is to its final destination, but their approach about what they use or how they go about it. They're more so on the computer screen, there are more so behind the scenes thinking about Okay, what time does this plane need to take off from what runway so that it can go off in this direction? Right? They're super strategic, very analytical, they like to take their time and work on complex problems. So they're going to take more of their thinking power to determine and establish their success. So might be a minute 45. But that sums up your flight assessment experience.
Nicky Saunders 17:53
And if any of those sounded familiar to you, it probably does. But anyways, so let's get into this first clip about what's important nowadays, I want to have that kind of conversation when it comes to like your career, your business, what's needed, what's not.
Jennifer Lopez 18:14
I know, from my own experience, and my own life and other people that I work with, that you don't have to have a degree to have value, or to, you know, be of tremendous worth, to different businesses, that street smarts, that experience that just kind of internal kind of creative know how is just as valuable as a degree.
Mostafa Ghonim 18:44
Nicky Saunders 18:45
Moose, you want to go first?
Mostafa Ghonim 18:46
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I think right now, I will say this. For those who are listening, or at some point, you're wondering, man, is a college degree still valuable? I do. Because I know that's a dialogue that a lot of people wonder, even those who maybe have already launched a career or have a career have a business now and are thinking about how do I upgrade my skills. And I like what she's saying about this, because times have changed. Times have changed. There are a lot of big name institutions right now that are facing some heat, because they're keeping their price tag the same. But the learning experience has totally changed, right? Like I'm not going on campus, I'm not able to network with the same amount or in the same way that I normally would, if I was dorming at Yale or going to NYU or just just the overall college experience, right? That's a part of the tuition that you pay for whether you see it or they can justify on your tuition bill or not. In reality, that's a part of what you're paying for. So now people are exploring other learning opportunities or other learning alternatives, something to shortcut the learning process. Now I will say this. A college degree is great and I have a degree and I'm grateful for it. It's helped me tremendously. But the the experience part, man, if you're not mixing in the life experience with what you're learning, it really just kind of taps a ceiling over what you can even accomplish with that degree. So I love that what she's saying is that while yes, she does value education, she's not going to limit someone from an opportunity, at least would her organization or her team, because she understands that the life piece of it, the experience is just as valuable. So I love that what's your take of someone you know, someone like yourself, who is self taught in a lot of the things that you know, and I'm not so you receive any professional training, but you do a phenomenal job at like teaching yourself a lot of things, right? Talk about that? What's your perspective on it?
Nicky Saunders 20:45
So, um, it's crazy, cuz like, I have a degree, right? And many people don't know. But I have a bachelor's in cybersecurity. And I don't use a single joint of that. Right? And I think when you look at the whole, like, what J. Lo said, what people I think just society as a whole right now really looks into what kind of experience you have, what kind of creativity that you have, what do you bring to the table as far as ideas wise? Right? I think that value nowadays, is a little bit more than how much did you pay for in a degree. Because just because you know, how to read a book doesn't necessarily know doesn't necessarily mean that you know, how to work, the situation, how to work, even the machine how to work, you know, in her case, whether it's a soundboard, or whether it is a venture deal and things like that, like, what experience do you have besides shadowing your teacher? You know? And some of us get degrees that we just thought we had to get, but it had nothing to do with what our passion is. So a degree doesn't measure your passion. The degree doesn't measure what you honestly love to do sometimes. Now, am I sitting here saying that it is not needed? I think it depends on the profession. Right? But from me, who has learned almost everything that I do, through experience and self taught, I think, that says a lot about a person's character and work ethic, with how you were taught, and it wasn't necessarily given to you. You know? People look at that and be like, oh, okay, that's different. Like how long you've been doing this? Oh, four or five years, compared to somebody who just came out of college and got a degree. I'll go with the four or five years all day. I'll go with your stats all day, but your credibility your achievements, your accolades, all that great stuff. I'll go with that before a piece of paper that says that you were good in this class and this class and this class. Like, let's be real, we could Google anything. So getting a degree, I'm not trying to downplay isn't as hard as maybe before. Before Google days, I'll say that. Okay? Unless you're in the math situation, then there was always a calculator, at least when I was born, you know? So, um, but it's not hard to look up something to find something. Um, so I don't discredit the the degree situation. But I think what she said with, you know, now granted, the street cred clearly is different depending on where you were raised. Right? So I can't necessarily agree with that part. As far as like, you know, it goes with street credit, but the experience does give you extra value. I do believe in that. I think, um, what you've done plays a huge role of whether or not you are are able to do the job or not, right? Now, granted, I will never put in a resume or anything ever again in my life. Right? But that's no downplay to a person who has to right? I just don't know how to write one. And I don't know how to write one. And two, like, the things that like that we do can't really be necessarily fitting for, like corporate. I feel. Now, there are people who can rock out corporate, right? I actually look at them and be like, Man, that's dope, like, I love corporate people. But at the same time, like...
And I think maybe because from the the Navy standpoint that I come from, is, just because you have a piece of paper doesn't make you better for the job doesn't like I can be the best fit. And just because I didn't get a degree, I didn't, I couldn't get the job? But this person did. And they're trash. Like, I don't I don't get that. I don't. It's It's weird to me. So I definitely respect that she was like, yo, creativity experience, just your whole vibe, is giving you the value and not necessarily the degree because of based off what she went through, right? And I think, to each his own, like, I want people to go to college, if it's needed for where you need to go. Like if it's going to get you to the next level and everything like that. I just for me off of my personal experience felt like I went there for no reason. Because I'm not using it? I'm not using it. Praise God I went to the military. I didn't have to pay for it. But I paid for it through all those years. But praise God, that didn't happen. Ya mean?
Mostafa Ghonim 26:49
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I'm the polar opposite. But I do think it definitely comes back to the the rules or the structure within the setting that you are aiming to be in, right. Like, if you think about some of the organizations, companies, teams, brands, businesses that you want to partner with work with sometime down the line, or even the type of business brand or organization you want to start, right? What's the type of structure that you aim to add to it. So for those who have a very traditional structure, then I can see a college degree being valuable. But for someone in the music business similar to J. Lo, that's a very untraditional way to do business. Right? Like I understand there is the music business or the acting business. But yeah, when there is a team in terms of how your team rolls with you, that's a very untraditional way it's like us with you know, when we do our work with E, there isn't a particular schedule. Oh, yeah, you're gonna work nine to five. And this is the structure in which we do things. Of course, there is a structure, but it's a very free flowing seven days a week, you might be up till 3am. You might too, you know, and then 1pm it just very untraditional in the sense, because of what the environment requires. I would say definitely, it helps to know. And that's where some of that flexibility comes into place. Where do you want to be? What are you trying to build? so that you can know is that important? Is that a necessary step? But if you're getting it just to make other people happy, then you gotta, you gotta look in the mirror, man, you got to look in the mirror.
Nicky Saunders 28:22
It's a different vibe, I promise you. And that clip came from a LinkedIn interview J. Lo did. So you're probably gonna see that a few times. But I just wanted to credit that real quick, because creators credit other creators, I just had to put that out there. But let's get into this next one, as far as her work ethic, because like we said, a singer, actress, a TV show host with American Idol, mother, wife... like she just does it all. So where did that come from?
Jennifer Lopez 29:00
...I think it's the people who put in the extra work. I put in a lot of extra work. And it gets tiring. It's not the easiest thing all the time. But I always noticed that even within my own industry, the ones who work harder the ones who stay later, the ones who just are willing to do whatever it takes to get the job done are the ones who wind up going far. What I think I've learned and what I'm trying to do now at this point in my life is to say no a little bit more and, and hone it down to like working smarter, instead of working all the time, which was, you know, it gets tiring, right. How do you do it? And I'm like, please stop asking me a question because I don't know. And at some point, it's gonna catch up with me.
Nicky Saunders 29:42
So, um, there's two thought points right then and there in that clip, right. And so, for those who are watching on YouTube, you saw a younger, Jennifer Lopez, right and the later clip was more recent, I think about like, a year ago or so not even a few months ago. But, um, I think the work hard. So I'm a hard worker, right. So I'm, I'm not here to say anything negative about it because I am. And I think that goes with old mentality though. Like, she, when we were doing our research, her parents were hard working, you know, people, like always saw them working her mother was an entrepreneur, right? Dad had a, you know, a great living and always saw them working. And especially in a Hispanic family, you're going to see hard working parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, like that's what Hispanics do. We're hard workers, right? And so to to see J. Lo's work ethic of, you know, you got to work hard, you got to outwork the people and everything like that. I'm not surprised by having that. But the the similar thing that both of those clips had was, it's tiring, right? It's very tiring, like doing so much for so long. And reaching goals, but because of people who have work ethics like that, there's, there's a sense of never settling. You're never done with a certain situation. You're never done. There's always another goal. Okay, now another one. Okay. I got a I got a Grammy. Okay, where's the next one? Okay, I got a, you know, I finished this movie. Where's the next one? Okay, I got one album, let me get the next album, you know? You're always working in that can get draining at some. There was, um, there's a clip. I don't know if I have it for later, where she was like, Yo, I'm doing a sitcom. I'm doing the Vegas residency thing. And I'm doing American Idol literally, the same time. So within a week span, I'm doing the sitcom for four days, I'm flying into Vegas for that day or two, I'm flying into American Idol. That draining. So I think as you get seasoned in your career path, seasoned in your brand, you start to think strategic rather than on a physical manual standpoint. Right? Because you have to look at what other people have done on a success level and are they still doing the manual work? Majority of them are not majority, but you know, certain the typical aren't sitting behind a desk making things happen. Right? The, you know, the stereotypical kind of vibe, but you're about making strategic moves at certain points and not necessarily waking up the earliest going to bed the latest and it's... But at what point Moose, do you make that shift? That would be more of my question of, because I think I even still struggle with it. Like, what is the shift to go from? You gotta outwork them. You gotta outwork them. You gotta outwork them, to let's be strategic. Let's be intentional. And so where my thoughts and my moves out work the hardest worker?
Mostafa Ghonim 34:01
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You know, I definitely resonate with just the overall experience, especially as a first generation American, right, like when your parents migrate, or you're growing up, and you're on a new path that your family or you're breaking away from the traditional path that your family was on meaning, go to school, get a good job, and just kind of put your head down and work and wake up every day and repeat the same cycle. When you break away from that path. I understand the mentality to go out and just literally try to do things with no limits, right? It's just go. One of the greatest pieces of advice that I've received specifically on how you maintain this balance is that you have to make a deal with yourself. Right? You literally tell yourself, all right, and by you making a deal with yourself, it's almost your mind and your heart communicating with your body to take the mental strength and combine it with the physical strength and say, hey, look for the path that I'm on, I need five years I need 10 years, give me X amount of time to go all in. And when you give yourself you give yourself permission to go all in, you're never working with any level of regret or sentiment of man, am I doing too much? Man? Am I doing enough? Should I be doing more? Am I missing out on my personal life, because you've made that deal with yourself, and you said, look for this specific time period, I'm going all in. And I think that's what you see happen early on in Jennifer's career where she commits. And she outworks everyone, right? Taking on multiple projects, looking for new ways. But when you get to a certain level of success, or you grow your brand, and your business to a certain degree that you can honestly stand behind and be proud of, you have to make a shift. Because if you don't, you get bored, you get burned out, and you run into a wall where some of the things that you need to keep your stuff moving, they run out. mMybe you don't have the creativity, maybe you don't have the energy, maybe you don't have the desire to be around people and your gift is possibly being a flight attendant or a people person. So I think definitely making that negotiation or making that agreement with yourself to give yourself the permission to go wholeheartedly for a specific period of time, get to get there and then reevaluate and say, Okay, how am I doing? Am I where I want to be? Can I change my strategy now of how I look at work? Right? So I think now she's definitely at a place where she's amounted a great deal of capital, and you start to see her now pulling back. And instead of just maybe working to make money and save it, she's looking at what she has and she's saying, Okay, let me invest in other industries. Let's make the money work for me, as opposed to me having to work and gain or earn more money to maintain my lifestyle. So yeah, I definitely can see both parts. And I think anyone who's listening needs to just evaluate based on what level of the game am I in, right? And don't don't evaluate based on a $400 million scale, that's Jennifer's net worth, right? Look, if that's what you're striving to great. But again, the point is for you to take what has been applied at other levels or within other industries and other people and and apply it to yourself and say, okay, based on where I'm at my ambitions of where I want to be, and what makes me happy, what can I apply? Or where, where can I be, so I would say definitely, you know, evaluating and seeing where you stand to make that adjustment that that that's the best path to go.
Nicky Saunders 37:32
That's good Moose. That's good. That's good. Okay, so, next, next clip: picking projects, so kind of going to the same part of that strategic vibe. But let's see how Jennifer Lopez picks her projects.
Jennifer Lopez 37:52
It's really about the quality, the quality of the projects, like I said, and and knowing which ones are going to have the best ROI. Right? And so, first, I have to love it, I respond to it. And, and creatively, the artist in me has to be singing, but also, you know, not taking on something that's going to take up seven months and yield this much. And then my whole year is gone. And then I have to like scramble to like make up you know everything you know the deficit in other ways and with a lot of other projects that I don't give me as much passion.
Nicky Saunders 38:29
That's good. That's so good. That's so good. Yeah, sounds a LinkedIn for saying all those questions as they listen.
Moose start this off, because that I feel, I feel this one.
Mostafa Ghonim 38:45
I feel good. Yeah, no. And literally, I think listening to it today is what kind of helped me reach a level of balance even with with what I'm currently going through, right? Because I have been at a place of man, how do you maintain that balance of where you give your energy or how much energy you give to it. I love what she says off the bat, she says you have to evaluate it. Yes, the creativity matters. Some of the things in terms of the project demands lining up with what you're passionate about. But also now taking a look at your the ROI. Meaning is the return on my investment in terms of and again, don't just look at money, the returns on investment in terms of my time, my effort, my energy, my sacrifice away from other things that are valuable to me, whether that be family for you, whether that be just quality time with yourself for things that you love to do. I think it really helps you put into perspective, you know, how who, where I should dedicate my energy, who I should even work with, like for those who are in a service based industry and you work with clients. It gives you an idea of what type of clients are you going to continue to take on, even if they're paying you premium dollars, is it worth the sacrifice, you know, to her point that you're making To make that money, so I love her approach to that, and definitely something that I will adopt as well moving forward, just because I feel where I'm at right now I can benefit from tremendously is like, all right, where am I investing my energy? And how much do I give to it is a great way to determine what projects what areas that I will I will continue to work with moving forward to what do you think?
Nicky Saunders 40:23
I think just cuz as being a creator, like this hits, because the the important thing, like certain key words that she said was like, yo, that I still keep that creative vibe, majority of creators just want to create, like, and sometimes we take on a lot, like, because we just want to create, and we're not necessarily always looking at the ROI. So that's a major shift that I think, artists, creators, anybody in kind of the creative field, can really hear and listen from, because it has to have a balance of I can still stay in my passion, I can still stay in my creative whole vibe. But if this takes long, what am I getting in return? Does it make sense? Can...Do I have to at the end of it, start doing pointless little projects, because I have to get this bag back? Right? I have to pay bills, the lights got to stay on. But I was staying. So focus on this one thing because they said, Hey, do this, and you'll get a certain amount, and you're doing it, but it took longer than what it usually does. And all these other things. And at the end of the day, was it worth it? You know, so from her saying that from even though now she's more in the business mind, she still has that Yo, I was, you know, I'm, uh, I still sing, you know, I still love to act, that creator vibe is still in me that artists vibe is still in me. And I have there has to be a certain kind of level of that in that project. Because I won't be interested. If it's not, but I have to be realistic of is this worth it? As far as whether it is time whether it is the opportunity, whether is the money, whatever it is, is it worth it to really bring do this project and really go all in on it. And that's, that's so important to creators that's so important to these different artists, because you can get just caught up in the creative mode. You can just like, Oh, this is, this is not about a bag. This is just because I love to create. I love what I do. And this is so amazing. and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you get burned because you can't pay your car note. Or, you know, you really couldn't do the the vacation you wanted to because you didn't save up the amount of money because you were so focused on this one bag, one situation one opportunity that at the end of the day didn't really even equal up to your, your time and your investment in your creative ways. So I thought that was and that was so good. Because Yeah, that was just that was just needed. That was just needed.
Mostafa Ghonim 43:43
Yeah, yeah, no, it's important. And I love in even in in for those who are interested in checking out that for interview. There's a portion on there where she talks about her realization that the creator is the main objective in a project, right? It's not the people funding the project. It's not people necessarily who are just running the business side. Now don't get me wrong. That part is important. And they both need to coexist. But you hold the key. Right. So I think that part in combination with what she's sharing there in terms of how she even picks about her project, I think that part is important too. Yeah.
Nicky Saunders 44:18
Let's get into the next... well I haven't done no air horns.
Mostafa Ghonim 44:24
One time for the one time,
Nicky Saunders 44:26
One time one time.
I'm sorry, if you are in like your job. I apologize. But, alright, let's get into this. I thought this clip going into it was very interesting, because I think the biggest problem that entrepreneurs have is that work life balance. And really, one thing that we highlight the best on one side doesn't really transition on the next side, but you will you hear what I'm talking about?
Jennifer Lopez 45:05
I'm a runner. I've always been a runner. Yeah, since I was little, and I'm always running like, I just don't slow down. And that's great for professional life. You know what I mean? It, it keeps me focused, and I'm always overachieving and stuff like that. But in relationships, it's not great. You must take your time, you must know, you know what I mean? You have to be slow with things.
Nicky Saunders 45:27
this is my thing. This is why I bring this up.
So, your work ethic is amazing.
at work on your career? All that great stuff, right? It is amazing. Um, does that translate into a relationship into your personal life? Now? I think if you keep that same energy, it could. But I'm going to say sometimes people don't. And, or they do and it's overwhelming. You know, um, so Moose to you, what are some traits that you know that are common that may work in one end but not the other and kind of vice versa? Like one or two things are not like a whole list? Like, Oh, nope.
Mostafa Ghonim 46:34
According to my calculations?
Nicky Saunders 46:36
Yeah, yeah, I pretended like I had a scroll. I had to pretend like that. That was not from from the soundboard. I just pretended like I had a scroll. But, um, yeah, like some some things that just don't translate.
Mostafa Ghonim 46:48
Yeah, I think the passion is definitely one of them. Because we can understand the passion in one particular area can help because you are dedicated to your craft, you bring a certain level of energy to the work that you do. And it helps how people receive and respond to that work. But in other areas, if you're not mindful of who is in your space, especially your immediate, intimate space, whether you're talking about personal relationships, or just close relationships in general, you got to be careful to not treat people or expect people to be like you. That's one of the biggest areas that did that same exact passion that's helping you here can create major turbulence and resistance in another area. Because now people are starting to see like, do you think that I'm broken? Do you think...can you just ever listen to what I have to say without giving me a lesson about what I should be doing? So that unsolicited advice, or pushing people beyond their limits, or pushing people outside of the areas that they want to be pushed, that's what definitely creates a level of discomfort in your relationship, where you can see it working there. But then when it comes to that particular area, it doesn't work. And that's why I feel she's saying, you know, in relationships, it's important to slow down, because it gives you an opportunity to learn about someone's demeanor, how they respond, how they need to be treated, where they thrive, and even where they need help. But it's about coming to a mutual agreement about those areas. Because just because someone needs help in a particular space, it doesn't always mean that they're ready to accept help. And that's a major difference. Yeah, that's a major difference. So I may be ready for help. But I don't want you to help me with it. It's some some people like to figure it out on their own. They're just not ready to overcome that, that mountain or that, that hurdle, and they're trying to take their time with it. So it's definitely something to be mindful of man, the minute you start treating people as you are or comparing to your personal standards, that's, I think, where you can create a disconnect.
Nicky Saunders 48:51
Yes, that's, that's good. Like, I was just listening to that. And I'm just like, Man, what were praised at one point, were, you know, kind of talked down to one on on another standpoint, like it seemed as a negative, right. And in, I guess, like, for me, that's almost like I get it. But at first, it was hard to understand. Because I think she has such a work ethic, I have to a certain point. Like, I'm my business standpoint, my brand standpoint, work and everything is always turned on. So you're telling me, I've gotten this far, doing it this way. But when I do it over here, it's bad? Like, and then so does that make me kind of think about like, so, what's the priority? You know, what, how does? If it's bad here, is that a priority? Right? How do you make it right? Um, of course, now they're during this time her family, you know, her husband is way more important than, than her work and things like that. But she's gone through and not getting into no real situations with it. But she's gone through her works of relationships that she's learning from all of this, you know, she, there's so many lessons from each L that she gets from, whether it's a failed personal relationship, or failed business relationship, right? she's learned from each one to then come up with the whole, you know, what, sometimes you gotta slow down, sometimes... makes sense. Because even in the work ethic, she was like, Yo, I'm so fast. But that shifted too. So I think as she got older, and then she got wiser and went through some things, she realized, slowing down. isn't that bad.
Mostafa Ghonim 51:07
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. For sure. And I think you can compare this a lot to maybe a spouse who isn't totally bought into your vision or your your, your idea of building a specific business or a brand, a family members who are not approving of your entrepreneurial endeavor, right, you can really compare it to the same exact thing. But I feel that if there's a moment in my life, especially where I had to stop to communicate my appreciation for the care, but to also describe my perspective, as well, in terms of why and how I was doing what I was doing, and that really altered the type of feedback and support I was getting in how I went about building my business. So I think at some point, you have to take ownership of how you communicate what you're doing. And also give them the opportunity to support you in their own way, right? Like, your spouse may not be...yes, you just go work 19 hours a day, you know, like, just go for it, you know that that support for them might be just like, hey, okay, I just don't work. But don't, don't tell me about it when you come home. Like maybe that's their support, right? Like, I'm good with that. But, and I think that's where you have to start working that balance. And now with her partnership now with with A. Rod, you start to see that she's openly talking about the good of the relationship, because he's letting her go without any limitation. So it's by him supporting her work ethic that she's starting to see the need to give back to the family. It's one of like, the craziest dynamics, but that's almost what it seems like. So I think definitely be mindful of what support is like from those family members, or spouses or people close to you and loved ones, you know, as it relates to what you're pursuing.
Nicky Saunders 52:58
That's a whole bar.
So let's get into this last clip because when you hit the fame and the success, like what really happens? Like, I think we all want it, but what, what really goes down and are you really ready for it?
Jennifer Lopez 53:25
Nobody's writing the book on how to be famous, you know what I mean? Like or what it is, when you get fame when all you wanted to be was an artist, you know? When all you wanted to do was sing or dance or you know, act or being a movie. Nobody writes that book. And I know because other people ask me. Other artists now asked me like what should you know? And I was like, you just have to handle it with grace and humility and be grateful for every moment. That's all I can tell you. Because it's a tricky, tricky thing. You see people succumb to it all the time you go Why did this artist kill himself or this one wound up doing this or this one's self destruct? It's not easy.
Nicky Saunders 54:06
Alright, um, praise God for this, this show because we try to break down what happens when you do get successful, the highs and the lows of that. Shameless plug. But, um, so does that kind of contradict the statement of like minded people being in this community, blah, blah, blah. I'm not saying it does. But if you believe and then see it happen as far as being successful, getting to new heights, doing breaking records and breaking situations that never happened before. You're creating your whole new lane, but there's no one you could really talk to, that has done it the way you have. And can really guide you, once you reach a certain point. Like I'm, I'm cool with, you know, outgrowing some of your friends based off what you're doing, but you're telling me at the highest of high, there is no one really you can talk to. Like you're now... and maybe that's where the shift is, from, except from the whole, not necessarily feeling like you're alone, but understanding maybe that your role has just shifted to now teaching, you know? To now, I've hit the highest. So now let me help others get to this point, because I know there's no other person that can really speak the way I can. Like, there's so many things I could say about this, like, because I don't want to think that, hey, I get there and I'm gonna be lonely. I'm gonna be, you know, I'm not gonna have anybody to be like, yo, you know, did you break? Did you see these numbers? And you're like, Nah, I've never seen these numbers. Yo, did you make this amount of money? I've never made this amount of money. Yo, did you have these? No. Okay, then why do I have you around? Ya mean?
Mostafa Ghonim 56:38
Man, I'm just, I'm just thinking if it's if the approach is about the people, or kind of even questioning self to say...the success wasn't all it was thought out to be right. Like, that's another way you can think about it. You can look at your people and say, Why are you in the circle? But then again, you can also say, Man, why am I here in terms of my actual career success, which is kind of crazy. But you know, you, I like what she says about think about almost, and I'm paraphrasing here, but think about when you first got started. Grace, humility, right? Practicing kind of just those fundamental habits to kind of keep you grounded, so that you do not get far attached, because you have to think, like J. Lo, his net worth right now is 400 million. Right? So there are a lot of male counterparts. And you can see why there could be difficulty in even finding a partner. Right, like that. And I'm not trying to turn it into that type of show. But you can see, right, traditionally, if the male is supposed to make more than a female, or however it is, nowadays, I'm not 100% sure. But that can still create a disconnect, because you don't know what my life entails at this level. So how can we become together as one? So I think there's a lot of different ways to look at it. But really, what I take from it is that at some point, everybody doesn't know what they're doing. In some part of the journey, whether that may be in the beginning, whether that may be you get to a level of success that you just you're at new heights, that everything is brand new territory, and it gives almost the confidence to say like it's okay, sometimes if you don't know, right? And if you tried seeking counsel, and you can't seem to find the person that resonates, you can continue to embark and discover for yourself, right? Because some people might get to that to the edge and stop because they're like, well, I can't see what's next anymore. And that might freeze them. where someone...like a J.Lo was saying, Well, I'm going to continue to go by practicing those fundamental habits that I learned that the beginning where I knew I just wanted to act, I wanted to sing because those were my passions. I'm going to be grateful and practice grace and humility, and continue to take it one step at a time. So I think there's definitely a few different ways you can break it down in terms of what it's like at that very top level. But I guess we won't know until we get there. Notice I said when.
Nicky Saunders 59:15
So so this is why you telling me her in the dancer didn't work out? It's just not the same level? Just, I'm just saying. I mean, don't mind me, don't mind. I mean, it's something that came through my head when you said that, I mean, from a discipline, like a personal standpoint, like is, is that why certain celebrities don't work because one goes a little bit too higher than the other one. You know, clearly there's other reasons but I'm just saying like even as as we grow, and you know, our community grows like are they going to I'm trying to find the balance of when does that break? Like, when do you do this together, do this together, and then it at the end of the day, it's just going to be a lonely road. Like to sit here and say that we're not going to be successful is blah, like, that's not gonna happen, we gonna be one of the top podcasts out there, if not top, I'm just saying, right? Um, and hold on, hold on. I'm just saying, but um definitely in the business category. But when when you know, that's, neither here nor there. But, um, if you're sitting here saying, okay, it's going to be lonely on the top. And you've heard that multiple times, right? I'm trying to understand and maybe this is the pilot in me. Why am I dealing with certain people viewing gonna be around at the end of this? What is what is the point? Now? I'm just saying, I'm just saying, however, comma, um, then I flip it into each person near life is here to teach you something to get you to the next level. Right? And so the communities that you're in the mentors, the, you know, whether it's physical mentors or digital mentors, right? They're all placed in your life to get you to the top. And then I feel that once you are there, it is not about feeling alone, but then it has to switch to helping others get to the top so you're not alone. So there's other people that could be there or even pass you. You know, I mean, shout out to to LeBron, he killing the game. And he's about to the question of Michael Jordan and LeBron is now a serious, debate. Before it was like, okay, you cute MJ is still the vibe, right? MJ is still always going to be the G.O.A.T. But now, it's more of a well, is he the G.O.A.T. of just that era, instead of the greatest of all time basketball in totality? Right? So LeBron could look at his at his teammates, and not really have those same conversations. He would have to go to Jordan, you know, he would have to go to some of the Hall of Fame people, right? Because he's right there. But when he passes it, what's gonna happen?
Mostafa Ghonim 1:02:48
Right. But I think, yeah, I think that's the beauty of some of the people like a Kevin Hart, and all the people who we've done, breakdowns on, like a Kevin Hart. We even saw some of it with Floyd Mayweather. LeBron, you mentioned that example, where you want to be conscious and aware enough to make sure that there is a select people you want to bring with you, no matter where you go. Right? Like, we have to believe that we can attract a select few individuals that are meant to stay with us, Jay Z. Another example who we see almost his entire circle, he's helped them become, you know, million dollar brands or businesses because of like, hey, I want to maybe I learned from that mistake that I did it, there are some people who didn't nurture enough relationships, or didn't grow enough of their people. So that when they got to their highest level of success, they felt lonely. But knowing that I can now be more intentional to nurture certain people on my team or within my circle, so that when it does happen, and when that time does come, I now have people surrounding me who have grown with me at the same time, maybe not on the complete same level in every area, that's okay. But they can still understand what it means to be at the highest of highs, but still keep some of our true authentic roots with us, so that we don't ever lose track of where we came from. Right. Like, you know, her still still saying, Jenny from the Block, or at least performing that song at the halftime show. Right? It shows a connection to those roots, where if she would almost turn her back on that part, it gives you a different it's almost distasteful. But yeah, I think that's definitely one of those moves that you want to plant. And And the funny thing is that that strategy is applied now, right? Like that strategy isn't practiced. When you become successful. You're like, Oh, yeah, let me go build people. No, you have to start dedicating a portion of and this is where you have to look at that ROI. And see how meaningful those relationships and what it would feel like to you now, to dedicate some energy to your people to build them up currently, so that in the future, you can reap those benefits. So it's definitely a tricky scenario, but worth a shot when you study the greats, those who have done it right and those who haven't and is like, man, the difference is key people built their people while they were growing. Instead of saying, well, you wait back here, let me go do my thing. And I'll come back and get you by the time that happens, you forget about it.
Nicky Saunders 1:05:21
Yeah, so I think what we're trying to say is groom them while you're broke. Nah.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:05:28
There you go. That's a good way to say it. Yep that's good.
Nicky Saunders 1:05:34
If they could rock with you, while you broke imagine, while you're rich, I'm just saying, but
Mostafa Ghonim 1:05:40
That's funny, but that's real.
That's funny but it's real.
Nicky Saunders 1:05:44
Um, but it... And I know, we gotta go, but I just...How do you find? Like, and I know, people are gonna ask that like, yo, how do I find those key players that I can bring up with? Because, yeah, I believe that I'm going to be successful. And I have certain people around me. But are they the ones that I want to bring up with? I want to make these millions of dollars with I want to go to the runway and these award shows and go to these meetings and things like that they are going to be at the table with me. What are some of the like, if we look at a LeBron, if we look at a Kevin Hart, we look at a Jay Z, right? What was some of the traits that one or all of them had?
Mostafa Ghonim 1:06:44
Yeah, I think when you and this is where you got to point to the flight assessment for this, right? Because we know there are particular styles from the report that show us some people just have it naturally, they don't have to try, they don't have to be strategic about Oh, I'm gonna do this so that I can attract this type of person into my corner, for whatever reason, they they're just magnetic people gravitate to them, they want to be around them. And this is why you can even see there are those who are bad influences, right? They attract people to them, and they take them down the wrong path. But it's it's a it's a personality thing. But if you don't have it, right, if you don't have it, this is where you have to be honest with yourself and say, like, I can say that, I don't believe I'm that type of magnetic personality, where I just attract people to be with me just because, right because they just want to be in my presence. I believe that I, I, I attract by example. It's it's by me showing the growth in the transformation in my personal life, and what I'm doing professionally, that people are like, man, I have respect, and I admire what you do, or I appreciate the work that you put in, or I appreciate how you continue to carry yourself. So you have to know like which one am I and I have to apply the right strategy based on your style. But if if I continue to try and be you know, the extra and and I'm not knocking anyone, if that's your style, but if if that's if that's the strategy, I'm trying to apply, and that's not who I am, there's always going to be a disconnect. People are not going to sense it you're going to you might do a good job of attracting people but they're not going to stay with you. So I think the to answer your question, it comes down to really identifying who am I? Am I mastering who I am and who I'm becoming? Because it's that that will attract the people right so I think it's a it's really a combination of the two and and people won't deny that
Nicky Saunders 1:08:39
Yeah, we gone go. We gone go end that right there cuz I think we could go on this convo. I think we go on this convo.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:08:48
This is it. This is one of them for sure.
Nicky Saunders 1:08:50
Yeah, we can go on this comvo. But let's figure out what Jennifer Lopez is. I'm actually kind of confused by this one. I'm not gonna lie. I may go with the default of you're an entertainer and this is what I feel like you are. But let me let me...Let's have this conversation. So Moose. Your first we have all the characters up the pilot, the flight attendant grounds crew and air traffic controller. Based off the flight assessment. What do we think J. Lo is?
Mostafa Ghonim 1:09:30
I was I was gonna say wait. Not.
Yeah, she is not
an air traffic control.
Nicky Saunders 1:09:44
Not air traffic. I could. I could agree with that. She just started getting strategic.
She just, she just started to slow down. She's been she's been going wild this whole time. She's been going wild this whole time.
Okay, um, I am...I feel like, as much as I love them, I keep always calling them out. But I'm going to say sorry, grounds crew.
I don't think until maybe recently, she didn't really play the supportive role. She wasn't really like slowing down. Nothing like that there was no pace that was really, you know, worth talking about to be honest. It was just really fast. It was really doing a lot. So, all right Moose. Now, there was two.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:10:50
Can we just talk about that, that this is actually a difficult decision when you think about J. Lo? Yeah, yeah, this is difficult, because, like, to your point, though, it comes down to that concept of, well, are we talking about J. Lo on stage the performer or J. Lo the person who's pursuing right pursuing the hustle or building herself up. Okay. So it's definitely one of those conversations, but I will say, Hmm,
I'm gonna go with a flight attendant on this one. I'm gonna go Yeah, I'm gonna go with a flight attendant on this one.
Nicky Saunders 1:11:29
I don't want to give the fail sound effect. I don't know. Okay, so, like, I could see what you're saying. Like, I definitely could see it. Because like I said, I was like, I'm not really sure. So I may get the default for entertainers. And for those who don't know what the default for entertainers, it's gonna be flight attendant, because they're out in front being the life of the party. J. Lo is the life of the party. Um, however, um, there's a lot of like, I'm actually no, I'm agree with you. Because what exactly what I was going to say, It resembles E and I and know, I know what E is. So exactly work ethic like crazy. But I'm doing this and that and this and that all at the same time. I'm actually a little bit overbooked, but we're here making a lot of money. And I'm good, like, so. Yeah, I can see. Yeah, I can agree.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:12:30
And that's why that's why I said that is like the many different projects at once. Wanting to just take on any and everything in between, of course, when it fits a certain criteria, but I'm like, yep, you can see that flight attendant. really driving the pack.
Nicky Saunders 1:12:46
Yeah, I agree. Let's do the bomb for that one.
I'm a let that rock. This is a long bomb. This is a long bomb.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:12:59
For those from NY you know about the flex bomb?
Nicky Saunders 1:13:01
Yes, that's a long bomb. That is a whole long bomb. So real quick, real quick, real quick announcement. Remember when I talked about the review, and the person said Facebook, so every Tuesday and Friday at 7pm Eastern, we go live kind of talk to you guys give you a preview of what happens for the next episode as well as an open conversation with me and Moose, just because people want to get to know a little bit more about us. So hence why we started off a little bit just personal. And but I know one of the requests is to get to know us a bit more. So Tuesdays and Fridays, Tuesdays and Fridays, Tuesdays and Fridays 7pm. Eastern on Facebook. This is...Nicky and Moose. I made a whole new Facebook, Nicky and Moose on Facebook, Nicky and Moose on Instagram, Nicky and Moose on Twitter. We gotta get back better on Twitter. But Nicky and Moose everywhere on social media. Go follow us. But Moose, final words.
Mostafa Ghonim 1:14:12
Yeah, I like this, what we said on and actually, it's funny enough, we said this one on our Facebook Live Stream. So I'm gonna bring this one here too. Be mindful of where you invest your energy just as you do with your money. All right, it's like that. That ROI piece I think is critical. So invest your energy the same way you invest your money. Calculate the ROI.